[Transcript] – The Single, Most Comprehensive Stem Cell Procedure Known To Humankind: How A “Full Body Stem Cell & Exosome Makeover” Works.

Affiliate Disclosure


Podcast from:  https://bengreenfieldfitness.com/podcast/anti-aging-podcasts/stem-cell-makeover/

[00:00] Runga Event/ Kion Lean

[06:08] About Dr. Harry Adelson & Dr. Amy Killen

[23:41] The Stem Cell Theory of Aging

[34:32] Overseas Stem Cell Testing

[39:50] Fat Stem Cells Vs. Bone Stem Cells

[42:52] Dr. Adelson's Stem Cell Procedure

[57:00] What to Expect After a Full Body Stem Cell Makeover

[59:49] Joovv Lights/ Onnit Products

[1:03:01] About Dr. Amy Killen

[1:06:59] Regarding PRP & Exosomes in the Penis

[1:18:04] Face Lift, Breast Lift & Hair Transplants

[1:27:00] What are V-cells and How They Work

[1:28:53] Post-Care Treatment Procedures

[1:32:47] Where to Get Procedures Done

[1:38:09] End of Podcast

Ben: Hey, it's Ben Greenfield.  I've got a lot of questions since I got my whole body injected, head to toe, up and down with stem cells.  So today you're going to find out when you inject your whole body with stem cells 'cause I got these two brilliant docs on the show who fill us in, not only on stem cells but also things like exosomes and PRP.  It's an interesting show, so if you're into anti-aging and recovery and some bleeding edge techniques, notice how I say bleeding edge instead of cutting edge 'cause I bled a little bit for the procedures you're about to hear in today's show.  This show is for you.

Before I talk a little bit about stem cells though, a few quick things.  Runga is an event that I am participating in October, specifically October 11 through 14.  You basically come and live in a mansion with me and a bunch of manual therapists and chefs and teachers, and we do intensive breathwork, we do cold water immersion, we do kettlebell training.  My wife is going to be there, she's going to do a sourdough bread making workshop, they'll be a raw chocolate workshop, coffee bar, biohacking bar, a ton of fun.  This thing filled up like gangbusters and then a room opened up two days ago, so if you want to get in on that, you just go to rungalife.com, RUNGAlife.com, discount code “Ben”.  Well, it's not a discount code they have a whole bunch of cool V.I.P. gifts that they give people who use that code.  Rumor is there might even be one of these fancy Joovv lights thrown in the mix, so if you want to get into that last room, which is right now open, you go to Runga Life, as in RUNGAlife.com, and use the code Ben when you register.  Boom, you'll be off to live in a mansion with me and a bunch of other cool folks, so come hang out in California.

This podcast is also brought to you by what I consider to be the most potent way to lose fat fast and to keep your sugar levels stabilized, without actually pouring harmful or harsh central nervous system stimulators into your body.  There are two ingredients that I personally use for this.  One is called Rock Lotus extract, which is also actually a fantastic liver cleanse, and the other is called Wild Bitter Melon which is almost like exercise in a pill.  It is also more powerful in my opinion than the diabetic drug metformin, as far as managing your blood glucose levels.  So these things have a lot of longevity benefits, but they also a lot of weight management benefits.  They work really well too for white adipose tissue to brown adipose conversion if you're doing something like cold thermogenesis.  All these ingredients are in a formula that I have over at my website Kion, KION.  It's called Lean, Kion Lean, so you go to getkion.com, getKION.com, and we have really, really high quality amounts of both of these herbs Rock Lotus and Wild Bitter Melon in this one ingredient.  So it's almost like you get to take wild plants in capsule form, so check that out at getkion.com, and it's called Lean.

Another interesting superfood that's not an herb, it's a nut.  It's called the Baruka nut.  My friend, who's a super food hunter and was a guest on the podcast, Darin Olien.  He travels all over the world, looking for the most nutrient dense foods, and he recently discovered these Baruka nuts in Brazil.  They're actually known in Brazil as the “viagra of the Sarado” because their packed with zinc, which is really good for a libido.  Whole bunch of other minerals, a ton of fiber, ton antioxidants, but they have less calories than any other nut.  They're mouth-watering though.  They taste like a mix between popcorn and cocoa and peanut butter.  They've even replace macadamia nuts as my nut of choice when I travel.  These things are really hard to import, but Darin's got a company now where he's able to get them into the US, and he's also basically setting this up so that it's all good for the planet.  To grow almonds in California, they have to use more water than the entire population of Los Angeles and San Francisco use in a single year.  That's how much water these almond growers use.  Baruka nuts, on the other hand, require a zero artificial irrigation.  They grow completely in the wild, no pesticides, no herbicides.  They're now a big staple in my diet, and I recommend them to you, the Baruka nut.  So you get 15% off your Baruka nuts.  You just go to barukas.com/ben.  That's BARUKAS.com/ben.  Use the promo code “Ben” at checkout, and if you subscribe to some Baruka nuts, the company will give you a couple travel packs of Baruka nuts for free which are great for taking on the road like I do.  You can cancel any time, they have a full money back guarantee on that subscription, too, or you just buy yourself a bag and not get a subscription, it's up to you.  Barukas.com, BARUKAS.com/Ben.  Use the promo code “Ben” at check out.  Alright, let's go talk stem cells.

Ben:  It's pretty rare that I do this, but what you are about to hear is a two-parter, a two-part episode on the entire full body stem cell makeover with the cosmetic and sexual enhancement that I did down in Park City, Utah several months ago.  It's been awhile since then, but it's also taken a little while for me to (a) hunt down both of the skilled physicians who oversaw my procedure, and (b) for me to or wait a long enough period of time after the procedure to be able to actually tell you whether or not it worked, and as you're going to hear me allude to a few times, especially in part two of this podcast that will come after part one, they're both in this episode, the effects have been profound, not only in terms of much faster workout recovery but also the appearance of my face, reduction of wrinkles, volume of my hair, length of my orgasms, sexual performance, pretty much everything that I wanted and expected from the procedure I experienced along with the piece of mind, knowing that I have now a bank of stem cells in each of my joints that my body can rely upon as I age.  So, this really is one of the more advanced procedures that currently exists when it comes to upgrading your body, it is admittedly not an inexpensive procedure.  I mean what you're about to hear, all said and done, depending on which adventure you choose, is going to cost around 30,000 dollars.  However, if that's the type of thing that you're interested in doing to your body, it is well worth it in my opinion.  In addition to that there are many versions of what you're about to hear.  I mean you could just go in and do a PRP treatment or P-shot for the crotch for guys, so to speak, or an ocean for women, or you could just get exosomes and stem cells combined and injected into one joint.

So we're talking about, in the case of this podcast, me going in and doing everything which is what I wanted to do for the purpose of immersive journalism, but ultimately I'll quit talking here and bring you behind the scenes of this full body stem cell makeover, the first interview you're going to hear is with Dr. Harry Adelson, who is really one of the more well versed stem cell physicians in the US.  The dude is constantly learning, constantly adding special things like exosomes and bone marrow aspirate concentrate and bone broth soup of your body.  All of these things that he does, that you'll hear him talk about, he's very good at.  This is what the dude specializes in.  Then after I interview him, in part two, you'll hear the interview that I conduct with Dr. Amy Killen who is the cosmetic and sexual enhancement specialist.  So between the two of them, they went to town on my body for about four hours.  I'll include links to everything at bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover.  The URL again is bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover.  Part one was recorded at a coffee shop, sitting there with Harry, sipping espresso in Sardinia, Italy where we're both speaking at a longevity conference.  Part two with Dr. Amy Killen was originally supposed to take place right there in Sardinia, Italy as well, but wound up taking place via us conversing on Skype, thanks to the wonders of technology.  Ultimately, we're going to find out everything that you need to know from both of these folks.  So stick around for the special two-part episode, enjoy and remember you can leave all your comments, all your questions, access all the little things that I did to biohack my recovery, coming out and also to enhance my ability to be able to produce more of my endogenous stem cells going in.  I'll also include all the infrared light, ketone photobiomodulation, all that kind of stuff that I did as part of this procedure to enhance recovery, and I touch on that a few times during the episodes you're about to hear.  All right let's do this.

Ben:  The Italians certainly know how to make their coffees don't they?

Dr. Adelson:  Absolutely.

Ben:  I've got my Americano with just a small spoonful of hazelnut gelato in there which makes for an amazing creamer.  Your plain jane espresso over there, Harry.

Dr. Adelson:  An espresso from the people who invented espresso.

Ben:  That's the best way to do it.  So for those who are listening in, I'm here in Sardinia, Italy, as I alluded to in an introduction to today's show with my friend, Dr. Harry Adelson.  Harry is somebody who you've probably heard me talk about before because he is the man who oversaw my full body stem cell makeover, along with his partner, Dr. Amy Killen, who oversaw my complete sexual and cosmetic enhancement procedure that I underwent in Park City, Utah.  At the time that Harry and I are sitting here in this Sardinian coffee shop, just about, what was that Harry, month and a half or so ago?

Dr. Adelson:  Precisely, six weeks ago.

Ben:  Yeah, so a month and a half, I went under sedation in Harry's clinic, and Harry did an enormous number of injections and procedures on my body all for longevity, anti-aging and enhanced performance, and today we're going to open the kimono on what that was, what all went into it and why on earth someone would inject their entire freaking body with stem cells and other fringe substances that you guys are going to find out about in today's show.  So anyways we are here in Sardinia, I don't even know the name of this coffee shop, do you?

Dr. Adelson:  No, but we just both spoke at A-Fest.

Ben:  Yes, we're at A-Fest, Awesomeness Fests that Vishen Lakhiani, another one of our friends puts on and we're staying in this beautiful village called Forte Village in Sardinia where people actually do live a long time.  Why do you think people live a long time here, Harry?

Dr. Adelson:  Well it's the combination.  I mean they have tremendous sense of community, they have beautiful environment, they have terrific food and just an all-around excellent quality of life.

Ben:  Yeah, I mean I'm sure genetics plays some role in it, but I was actually reading an article that one of my friends text it to me just a few days ago about the copious amount of rosemary that is consumed here, and how they attribute the rosemorinic acid to some of their longevity as well.

Dr. Adelson:  It's amazing when you walk around and you just smell the ambient herbs everywhere, and then you go in and then you eat the cheese, and it's the goats that have been eating the herbs that you smell and then producing the cheese, and it's just great because the air that you smell as you walk around is what the salami and the cheese to taste like.

Ben:  Yeah, and I'm certain that here at A-Fest, the alcohol-fueled DJ parties that go on until four to six a.m. on the beach may not be quite in line with the Sardinian concept of longevity, but moderate drinking and hanging out in a social situation in the evenings.  I mean that's another thing you see prevalent in this culture.

Dr. Adelson:  That's right, that's right.  Of course, red wine contains high levels of pycnogenol, but I think it's probably the social aspects.  You know my belief with health has always been the four main pillars are diet, exercise, sleep and psycho-spiritual-emotional balance, and if you get a B+ in all four of those, then you get an A all round.  If you get a C in any one of those, you get a C.  If you just shoot for of B+ in all four areas, that's a cumulative A.

Ben:   So you've got a pretty extensive health background, I think I heard you saying your grandfather was a doctor?

Dr. Adelson:  My great, great grandfather was a surgeon in the Civil War.

Ben:  Now for you growing up, did that mean that you were encouraged be a doctor?  Did you grow up in a household where you expected that.

Dr. Adelson:  No, not at all.  He was the only other doctor.  I did not come from a long line of doctors, he actually was the only one.

Ben:  So tell me about your training, like how you got from that stage to being really at all these anti-aging conferences I attend and speak at.  I mean your name is on the tip of everyone's tongue as one of the leading kind of anti-aging docs, doing procedures like this, so how'd that happened, how'd that evolve?

Dr. Adelson:  Well, it was one of those things I feel like I worked my fingers to the bone for 20 years and then suddenly became an overnight success, and part of it was because being in the right place at the right time.  When I was in Naturopathic school, my first year of Naturopathic school, I had an injury to my shoulder, and at that time, I was completely fanatical about rock climbing.  My whole life revolved around rock climbing.  I mean you could say the reason I went to Naturopathic school was so I would have something to do when I wasn't rock climbing, and I tore a piece of cartilage in my shoulder, and I saw an orthopedic surgeon and he said, “Well, I can put a scope in there and we can cut out that piece of cartilage, and it's going to help in the short term, but in the long term, it's going to cause problems.”  And here I was young, healthy.  I was in Naturopathic school, and I just was unwilling to take no for an answer.  I said there's got to be a way that the body can kick start the healing response.  There's got to be a way you can supercharge your body's ability to heal itself, and I found out about a treatment called prolotherapy, which is the predecessor to stem cells therapy.

So prolotherapy is the injection of natural substances that are simultaneously nutritive and slightly irritating, injected directly into the damaged structure, in order to trick the body into thinking that it sustained a new injury, thereby launching the body's natural ability to heal itself.  I was trained in that.  Well, first of all, I got treated with it.  It salvaged my climbing trip to France because I'd been training like crazy for this trip to France, the birthplace of modern sport climbing.  My trip to France was great, I got trained in prolotherapy, and I knew that's what I wanted to do.  My first four years of practice, I just did prolotherapy.  Very simple treatment, you palpate the affected structures.  You inject glucosamine sulfate and dextrose and very inexpensive, natural substances.

Ben:  You're literally injecting, in some cases, I've heard it described as sugar solutions into the joints, right?

Dr. Adelson:  It's simultaneously nutritive and slightly irritating, so the sugar makes it hypertonic.  So sugar, after oxygen, is the most important nutrient to the body.  Without oxygen, you don't survive with a few minutes, and similarly with sugar, it's the second most important nutrient to the body for a moment-to-moment survival.

Ben:  Now I know I'm going to completely rabbit hole here, but I know some people who are very into the low carb diet and ketosis will say well, what, I thought the body could survive on ketones and its own fat.  So when you say that, are you saying that we need to costly have glucose in our bloodstream?  When you say that, are you referring to the trace amounts of sugar required for metabolic function?

Dr. Adelson:  No, you need sugar for metabolic activity but you can convert other substances into sugar, so you don't need constant intake of sugar, but your body requires sugar.

Ben:  Right, your body can make a lot of these sugars via proteins, via amino acids, via the glycerol backbone of fats, etcetera.

Dr. Adelson:  Right, I'm going to climb us out of that rabbit hole.  Then in 2006, platelet-rich plasma came along.  Platelet-rich plasma is you do a normal, just peripheral blood draw, just like you draw blood in the doctor's office, but then you put it in a centrifuge, concentrate down the platelets.  Blood is comprised of serum, red blood cells, white blood cells and platelets.  Platelets are cellular fractions that are responsible for healing of tissue.  When you have an injury, the platelets aggregate.  They clump and form a clot, but then they release proteins that trigger the healing of connective tissue.  Whenever you have an injury, it is platelets that trigger the healing of damaged tissue.

So then in 2006 we switched from prolotherapy, dextrose to PRP, injecting platelet-rich plasma and I found that I was able to get the job done in half as many treatments.  It worked approximately twice as well, but now, we had to use these somewhat expensive kits to concentrate the platelets.  It became reasonable to see what it was you were injecting, so we started using ultrasound guidance.  We would actually use an ultrasound camera to see the structure that we wanted to inject and then see the needle entering that structure.  So from 2006 to 2010, that's what I did.  2010, I had a patient come to me with a stack of scientific journals, and she said all these are journal articles or about the use of bone marrow stem cells for the treatment of arthritis, and back in 2010, it was all animal studies.  There was almost nothing in the human literature, and this woman said, and she's one of my favorite patients and I've been treating her for a number of years and I'd helped her some, but I just couldn't quite get her to where we got her need totally better.  She said, “Harry, I want you to inject bone marrow stem cells into my knee,” and I said, “Laura, I don't know how to aspirate bone marrow.  I don't know how to do it.”  I said, “I've heard of a guy who does it in St. Louis, so you can go to him, and she said I don't want to go to him.  I want to go to you,” and I said, “Laura, I don't know how to do it.”  She says, “Wwll learn how to do it,” and I couldn't argue with there.  So I learned how to do it.

Ben:  So you went to Youtube and watch the videos on YouTube?

Dr. Adelson:  More or less, I found there at that time there were about 10 doctors in the United States doing bone marrow stem cells.  I called the first nine, asked them if they would teach me.  I think they actually didn't hang up on me.  I think they threw the phone across the room.  The 10th doctor Dr. Joe Perrino in Boca Raton said, “Sure, come on down, I'll teach you to do it.”  He's an orthopedic surgeon.  I got to watch him do one, and then I had to learn how to do it.  At that time, that was really the extent of the training available to me in the United States.  Nobody was teaching.  If there were no trainings, there was nothing in the literature.  So for the next three years, I traveled all through Central and South America, learning from the Maestro's, from the people who'd been doing it for years.  I just went on this quest to find out who the most experienced people were in the world and I visited their clinics.

Ben:  Wow, okay.  So when you're saying the bone marrow aspirate, you're preferring to that procedure that looks relatively brutal on the video that I'll linked to at bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover.  That's where the show notes are for this show, at bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover.  You can watch the entire procedure that Harry conducted on me, but that was the part where you went in through my hip, that part where my wife cringed a little 'cause she was in the room, and you sucked the bone marrow out of it, the iliac crest?

Dr. Adelson:  It looks a lot scarier than it is actually dangerous or even painful. Now, of course, you were sedated by an anesthesiologist, so you didn't feel a thing, but even if someone were awake, it's really not nearly as bad as it looks, but yes.  So a bone marrow aspiration, just like it sounds.  In the body, there's a long bones and there's flat bones.  Long bones such as the femur do not really contain stem cells.  The flat bones such as the iliac crest are rich with stem cells, so that's why we take it from the hip.  That big frisbee-shaped bone in your pelvis, so we place a bone needle actually into the bone marrow through the hard cortical bone into the middle, the soft spongy bone called the medullary cavity or medullary bone.  We aspirate, it looks to the naked eye just like blood.  But if you look at it under a microscope, it's blood plus a ton of stem cells.

Ben:  It looks like a giant, giant syringe full of blood, and when I was watching the video, the procedure, that's what I thought it was.  That's all stem cells?

Dr. Adelson:  Well, there is peripheral blood in there because the bone marrow is the most highly vascularized tissue in the body, so you are getting blood, but it's blood and loaded with stem cells.

Ben:  So when someone comes to you to do a procedure like this, whether it's a full body stem cell makeover, whether they want a bone marrow aspirate like you did to inject into a joint, they don't have to have their fat stem cells or their bones stem cells previously banked.  You're harvesting them right there and then injecting them.

Dr. Aldeson:  That's exactly right.  We mostly just do same day procedure, so we aspirate the bone marrow.  We currently do fat liposuction as well and isolate stem cells from fat, but yes, we do primarily same day procedure.

Ben:  Now when somebody does something like that, can they take some of that, and rather than getting injected, somehow store it?

Dr. Adelson:  There are laboratories that will store stem cells, yes.

Ben:  Okay, gotcha.  So you could go and get the procedure done, and then somehow find a clinic that would store those for you.  Is it illegal to store them in the US, do you know?

Dr. Adelson:  It's certainly legal to store them, yes.

Ben:  Okay, alright, gotcha.  So I'd actually want to delve into some of the FDA legality issues here in a second, but kind of backpedaling just a little bit.  You were talking to me about how, for a guy like me, who doesn't have a lot of injuries, and I actually wasn't really in there to see you for some nagging, aching pain that had been a bane in my side as much as for longevity and performance.  Now you were describing to me this thing called the stem cell theory of aging?  Can you describe, couching in your description, exactly how the stem cells would theoretically work, what that theory is and why it would be important for somebody who maybe isn't injured to do some like this?

Dr. Adelson:  Sure, the focus of my practice over the last, close to 17 years, has been the treatment of chronic musculoskeletal pain conditions.  So low back pain, neck pain, arthritis, any sort of long standing chronic pain issue.  Because the types of people that we get a lot of farmers, ranchers oil field workers, cowboys we get a lot of very hard working people, who I jokingly say, have exceeded the limits of their warranty or exceeded the conditions of their warranty.  They've worked very hard over many years.  As a result, they have arthritis through their entire body.  Their entire spine is arthritic, and they're peripheral joints, their hips, their knees, their ankles, their shoulders, their elbows, their wrists.  As a result, I have done a lot of treatments over the years of these large treatments where we do people's entire spine, we do both hips, we do both knees.  On top of that, because we use an anesthesiologist and people are sedated, it really makes it very easy to do that because someone goes to sleep.  They wake up two or three hours later, and we're done.  Also because I'd never bill insurance.  A lot of guys who bill insurance, when you're billing insurance, you can only do one thing at a time, and if you want to do something else, you got to come back, and I think a lot of doctors get brainwashed into thinking that way, even though they're not billing insurance for a stem cell treatment.  They say, “Well, we'll just do your knees.  If you want your hips done, we got to do another treatment.”

So my point is I developed a reputation as the guy who will do these big treatments.  People who will just come in and get it all done at once, and over the last two years, I've gotten a lot more biohackers in, and as I put out more content on the internet and to some sort of people, my name got around.  I got more and more people saying, and I would affectionately use this term, the full body stem cell makeover.  People would say I want that.  I want my entire body treated, and I thought, okay, why not?  So I decided just formally roll, full body stem cell makeover as sort of a formal package for people who want to address the stem cell theory of aging, which brings me to the next part of your question.

So we have stem cells in all the tissues in our body, and their role is to maintain the health of their microenvironment, so whenever you have in, they just lay dormant, and if you have an injury, they go to work.  What ends up happening is if you have the three ways to really degenerate tissue, one is through a single traumatic injury that's so severe you don't completely heal from it.  The second is chronic overuse, and the third is just crappy nutrition and shitty lifestyle.  I mean if you just don't take care of yourself and don't give your body the nutrients and the rest that it needs, then it just doesn't function properly for you.  So in any of those situations, what ends up happening is you either deplete the population of stem cells in that particular region or those stem cells cease to function properly.  In either case you now lose the ability for the body to heal itself.  So what regenerative medicine and stem cell medicine seeks to do is to repopulate that area with robust stem cells that are functioning properly.  So the idea with the full body stem cell makeover is we just go ahead and proactively flood all the major musculoskeletal, all the moving parts of the body.

Ben:  It's essentially almost like the shotgun approach.

Dr. Adelson:  Exactly, we carpet bomb your body.  Your entire spine, both shoulders, elbows, wrists, hands, hips, knees, ankle, foot, with stem cells super charged with exosomes.

Ben:  And that's the next part I want to ask you about actually, thank you for providing that perfect segue for me because when I came your clinic, you said you're going to take my bone marrow aspirate and inject that, but you want to combine it with these things called exosomes, and admittedly, at the time, I didn't know what exosomes were.  I did some research myself and also talked to you a little bit, and I was flabbergasted that I hadn't actually heard of these little things before.  So describing what an exosome is and how something like that would work if combined with stem cells?

Dr. Adelson:  Sure, so let's go back to biology class, and we're looking at the diagram of a cell, you see there's the cell membrane surrounding it and then there's the big nucleus that contains the genetic material and there's the mitochondria and there's the golgi apparatus, and there's let's see if I can remember all those organelles, but there's all the different structures of the cell, and then you see these little vesicles and they're called exosomes, and when I was in naturopathic school back in the 90s, we thought that was the cellular excretion.  We thought that was the waste product because we didn't actually know what they were.  Okay, so what exosomes actually are?  So the way that the laboratories create exosomes to be used therapeutically are as follows.  They take placental stem cells.  So placental stem cells are most robust.  They're considered adult stem cells because they're older than embryonic.  So you take these placental stem cells which are incredibly robust, and you culture expand them.  So you grow hundreds of millions of these stem cells.  You then put them in a stressful culture medium.  So what that means is you trick the stem cells into thinking that their host is under duress, so they prepare for a lean times.  They think that they need to get ready for starvation or for injury.  They sprout these vesicles filled with growth factors that are the exosomes, and the membrane around these vesicles are exactly the same as the membrane around the stem cells.  So their ability to communicate with surrounding tissues is exactly the same as the actual stem cell's ability.  Then the laboratory destroys the stem cell and just harvest the exosomes.  So you're actually getting rid of the other person's genetic material, and you're just collecting the active ingredient.  It's what I like to call the currency of the stem cell because when your own stem cells would lose their potency, when they lose their ability to function at full optimal levels, what they are actually doing is they are losing their levels of the contents of these exosomes.  So this is the very static thing as we age, and our own stem cells cease to function properly that they are missing.  So supplementing with these exosomes really, you're getting all the benefit of culture expanded placental stem cells without the actual stem cells, without the other person's genetic material.

Ben:  Some of the studies I saw on exosomes were fascinating.  A once fascinating one was they serve as an endurance exercise memetic, meaning that when used exogenously or injected, it appears that they can induce some of the same responses as you get when you're a heavily trained aerobic or endurance athlete, and there's a host of other researchers who will dig up on exosomes, but just those alone are fascinating.  One thing I want to get back to though as you said they get rid of the DNA, they get rid of the genetic material, so you just get in the exosomes.  Does that mean that if you're injecting stem cells that do have other DNA or other genetic material in them like umbilical or amniotic than a lot of people do in the US that that would be potentially unsafe or less efficacious compared to something that has your own DNA or no other DNA at all?

Dr. Adelson:  Well the truth is we don't know, we don't know the answer to that.  We think there's no risk.  We think there is minimal to no risk.  Part of the why it's less scary than it sounds to use somebody else's umbilical course stem cells or such is one thing we do know is that your body does not actually integrate them.  These cells, and there's been studies where they take radioisotope-marked stem cells, umbilical cord stem cells, and they use them in somebody else, and they're able to see that they have this strong para-crane effect.  They have this sort of intercellular communication to launch your own endogenous stem cells to activate, but then they don't divide.  Neither do they self- replicate nor do they differentiate.  They just die off.  When you use allographic stem cells, meaning stem cells from another person, they don't actually take up residence in your body.  They have a strong short term effect but then they don't seem to have a long term effect, which is sort of the good news, bad news because the good news is we don't think that cellular material bit gets integrated into your own DNA, which is all the more reason to just use the active ingredient.  That's why I like the idea of the exosomes because you're getting instead of one million, like a typical.  If you get umbilical cord stem cells from most manufacturers, usually a single vial is going to contain around one million stem cells, whereas with the exosomes, I mean you can do the equivalent of many millions of stem cells, just the active ingredient without the cells themself.

Ben:  And then when you combine those with the bone marrow aspirate which is your own stem cells, I think you used the term super charging those stem cells to better be delivered to where they're needed in the body because you're combining them with the cell to cell communication vesicles?

Dr. Adelson:  You're combining the exosomes with your own stem cells that do get integrated into the area that you're injecting.

Ben:  Okay, that's pretty cool.  It's a one-two combo.  You hear a lot about this idea of medical tourism, right?  Like people going to Panama is one that's very popular.  You hear a lot of people talk about going to Panama for stem cells.  What's the legality currently, and why would people be going overseas still to do procedures like this?  That confuses me.

Dr. Adelson:  Right, so the main thing you would go overseas for is for culture-expanded either umbilical cord cells or placental cells.  You can just go completely bonkers with that.  That is the main reason 'cause currently it is not legal in the United States to use culture expanded umbilical cord or placental cells.  That's what's very elegant about the exosomes is a step around it.  Your culture expanding these placental cells, but then you're destroying the cells, so you're no longer breaking that rule because you're not administering the cells.  You're just administering what I would consider actually an organelle, but the main reason you would go abroad is either to culture expand placental or umbilical cord cells or to culture expand your own cells.  There are outfits in the United States that are culture expanding cells.  It is definitely a gray area legally.  The FDA is saying that it's illegal, but they have not been proven to have.  I mean, that's a very complex answer.  Let's just get to that part of it.

Ben:  Okay, alright, gotcha.   So basically, it would be to get a placental or an umbilical, culture expanded stem cell.  That would be why you would go overseas way, but if you were able to simply do something with the bone marrow aspirate, take it out of the iliac crest and then, even better yet, combine with exosomes.  You're getting a lot of the same effects.

Dr. Adelson:  I haven't been working with exosomes long enough to say, with any degree of certainty, but so far, I'm very impressed with it.  I mean I have been doing bone marrow stem cells for eight years, and I'm very impressed with the use of bone marrow stem cells, and it seems when you add the exosomes, it seems to really give it this super juicy boost, and I'm very pleased with it.

Ben:  What about the risks?  We talk about legality a lot of times.  There are legality considerations because it's considered risky or unsafe or unproven.  Are there risks?  And I say that because there's talk too about like people.  I think you're aware I got my fat stem cells harvested from the US Stem Cell Clinic, and people right away are tweeting at me and saying oh, they made people blind with stem cell injections.  There are other people, I was having dinner with somebody couple weeks ago, and he's like, dude, stem cells can go anywhere in the body which means that they could be carcinogenic and cause undifferentiated cell growth, especially of a tumor or something like that.  So are those kind of risks legitimate, and are there other risks?  What should people be aware of as far as risks go?

Dr. Adelson:  Well, the literature that does exists overwhelmingly is really, I am not aware of anything that makes me really afraid of cancer, especially when you're using your own stem cells, when you're using your own bone marrow stem cells.  There's really nothing in the literature using autologous stem cell.  So autologous is where donor and recipient are the same person.  There's was one case in the cosmetic surgical literature where they were using fat drive stem cells combined with a cosmetic filler, and it was a specific cosmetic filler that had a hyaluronic acid, but it also has these little plastic beads in it that are supposed to form scar tissue.  So you inject this hyaluronic acid with the plastic beads into the lips, scar forms around the plastic beads and actually makes the lips fuller.  Well something about the plastic and those beads caused the stem cells to differentiate into bone, so there's one case in the cosmetic literature where this woman develop these bone chips in her face, but that was one where they really got too cute.  I mean they were mixing it with this cosmetic filler that had been plastic beads in it, so I think as far as using bone marrow stem cells, the safety is just, really.

Ben:  So the more of the story is don't combine your stem cells with plastic and inject them into your eyes?

Dr. Adelson:  Well, first of all, don't inject stuff in your eyes, period.  I mean, we just don't know enough about it.  I mean that's neural tissue, that's not musculoskeletal tissue, the eyes are neural tissue.  As far as the exosomes, there is a small but growing body of data that seems that it is very, very safe.  There is a theoretical risk of cancer, and the manufacturer recommends you do a cancer screening.

Ben:  Okay, so I also want to back pedal here to the idea of why you would use bone.  I've seen the folks who harvest fat and use fat, say fat is superior as far as the mesenchymal active stem cells that you have.  I've seen people say bone is better.  I've had my bone harvested and stored from labs in Berkeley and then I got my fat stem cells stored from the US Stem Cell Clinic in Florida, and both said that their method was superior, as far as bone versus fat, fat versus bone.  What do you say, what's your thoughts on fat stem cells versus bone stem cells?

Dr. Adelson:  Sure, well first of all, I use both.  I started out using bone marrow.  I started doing bone marrow in 2010, but then I started using fat in 2013.  What I did when I integrated fat in 2013 is my instinct was to combine them together, but I thought you know, here's an opportunity to find out maybe one is better than the other.  Maybe I can just do one without doing the other.  So for a period of four months, I would do one or the other.  I would offer to people.  I would say do you want to bone marrow, with which I have quite a bit of experience and there's quite a bit of scientific data, or would you rather use fat which has less data?  You're going to get more stem cells, but I would just leave it up to the person to decide, and people would self-select as such, and about fifty-fifty in one group.  About half the people would take bone marrow and the other half would take the fat.  What I found is why I phoned people one year after the treatment, and as had been my experience, the people who got bone marrow got consistently good results.

I had about a 10% non-responder rate, but 90% of people got satisfactory outcomes.  With the fat group, when it worked, it worked better than bone marrow.  There was a superior outcome.  However, I had about a 30% non-responder rate, so it was less consistent.  So what I did was I switched to combining bone marrow with fat, and what I found was when I combine the two, I seem to get the consistency of the bone with the augmented improvements of the fat, and this is a paper that I had published in The Pain Practitioner, and you can find it on my website, but one of the things that I've just noticed in the industry is those people, 'cause you definitely have the bone marrow camp and then you have the fat camp.  They tend to sling arrows at each other, and what I found is the ones who sling the largest arrows, who did the other one the most are the ones who have no experience with whatever the other one is, and really, I think there's a lot of bias involved, and there's some people who like doing bone marrow, and they don't want to do fat and there's other people who like doing fat and they don't want to do bone marrow.  I like using both, I'm going to continue to use both unless the FDA tells me I need to quit doing fat, which may come to pass.

Ben:  Okay, thanks for enlightening me as to the bitter battles that go on within the stem cell industry.  Physicians fighting fat versus bone.

Dr. Adelson:  There's four guys and there's Chevy guys and there's fat guys and there's bone marrow guys.

Ben:  Exactly, that's what it sounds like.  Okay, so before we kind of go into what a step-by-step walkthrough of the full body stem cell makeover is, the other thing that I'm curious about when it comes to the use of stem cells would be some of the things that go beyond just joint pain.  People talk about TBIs, they talk about concussion.  When you're doing something like this and it's not for the joints, would you instead just go straight into the bloodstream.  I mean for something like longevity, right?  So I've got these fat cells harvested and bone cells harvested, and I've been encouraged to inject those every one year or two years or five years for longevity purposes.  How would you use stem cells aside from injecting them into the joint for other conditions?  What will be some of the more common reasons?

Dr. Adelson:  Sure.  Well, my practice is the treatment of chronic muscular skeletal pain.  So we only treat pain.  Having said that, every single person who comes to my clinic gets a little bit of stem cells IV.  Currently, we give the adipose drive stem cells intravenously.  We do not give the bone marrow stem cells intravenously, and that's just in case somebody has an undiagnosed bone or blood cancer.  I don't really want to give that IV.  We additionally give a little bit of exosomes IV.  So if someone's coming to me, I'm going to give them a little systemic boost with stem cells.  As far as the treatment of, you mentioned, traumatic brain injury, I mean the list of indications for stem cell therapy is staggering.  I mean, really.  It's like this mushrooming cloud.  Every year, there's a larger body of scientific literature showing a broader spectrum.  Name all of the specialties in medicine, neurology, pulmonology, cardiovascular, give me the entire list.  There is somebody studying stem cells for conditions in that category.

Ben:  Okay, so the one where you go, where you mainline via an IV into the bloodstream, that'll be what you do for longevity though.

Dr. Adelson:  Well, I do the full body stem cell makeover.  Me, I'm addressing the musculoskeletal system, and additionally, intravenously.  If you just wanted to treat the brain for instance, or if you just want to do internal organs, yes.  You would just do IV.

Ben:  So for something like decreasing the rate which telomere shortens or that anti-aging effect, would you get some of that, just from getting injected into the joints?

Dr. Adelson:  Well, when I inject the joints, I also get a little bit IV.  So, yes.

Ben:  Okay, so you're getting that either way if you go to your clinic if you get this done.  Alright, so the full body makeover.  You eluded to injecting every musculoskeletal joint from the ground up with the stem cells, combined with exosomes.  What else goes into this procedure?  When I walked into that room a month and a half ago, all I remember is someone told me to count from a hundred, down to zero, and I think I blacked out about 97 or maybe it was 93, and then what happens?  I woke up speaking French, and I can put a link in the show notes over at bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover if you want to see the hilarious video of the crazy things I said when I woke up, including speaking French, but between that time and the time those counting down to zero, what happened?

Dr. Adelson:  Right, as you're saying, the first thing that happens is you lay down on the table.  Well first thing, when you come to the clinic is you and I talk.  So we go over everything, make sure we've got everything exactly right.  You meet with the anesthesiologist, they make sure that they're happy, that you're happy, everything's on board, ready to go.  You speak with my nurse, so she's going to tell you what to expect afterwards when you wake up.  Then you go into the room, lay on your stomach, get a tiny little needle in your hand, count backwards from a hundred, get to about 96, and you go blissfully to sleep.  During that time, the first thing, currently I do a lipoaspiration, which is a miniature liposuction.  Take between fifty and a hundred CCs of adipose.  That adipose goes through a process where the stem cells get isolated.  Then we do a bone marrow.

Now we didn't do that with you because you don't really have enough fat, and with the full body stem cell makeover, I'm moving towards just using bone marrow and exosomes, but with you, we did the bone marrow aspiration.  That was the first step.  So we place a jam sheet needle, an eleven-gauge, four-and-a-half inch needle into your iliac crest.  I do both sides 'cause we want to get lots of stem cells.  I'm talking a very large volume of bone marrow.  We need a large volume of stem cells for this treatment.  The bone marrow goes through an ozone machine.  We ozonate the bone marrow to supercharge it with oxygen, and once it's been ozonated, then it gets centrifuged.  It goes into a centrifuge for eight minutes.  When you centrifuge bone marrow, the fat goes to the very top.  There's a little bit of fat in bone marrow.  The serum is above that.  At the bottom is the red blood cells, because of the iron content, they're the heaviest, and then the middle layer is the platelets and the stem cells.  We draw off the buffy layer, that's the good stuff.  We then add the exosomes to the bone marrow, to our bone marrow-aspirate concentrate, BMAC- bone marrow-aspirate concentrate.  When we do a full body stem cell makeover, we're using six vials of exosomes which is a huge dose.  Then we've got you face down, so I go ahead and inject the spine from the base of the skull to the tail bone on both sides every level.  We then have a very elegant way, we safely turn people from their stomach onto their back, and then inject both shoulders, both elbows, wrists, hand, both hips, both knees, both ankles, feet.  You then gently wake up in the recovery room.  In your case, speaking French, and that's it.

Ben:  I like how you allude to the fact that you elegantly rolled me over.  I think, according to my wife, I was flopping like a rag doll.  I guess she said that was the worst part, when you turned me over and I was just completely limp.

Dr. Adelson:  Well we're very, very careful not to let people get hurt.  We're very careful.

Ben:  Yeah, and then you know the next day, I obviously still had sedation chemicals in my bloodstream.  I was walking a little funny.  Frankly, I felt like I'd been hit by a truck, just stiff.  I went for a long walk.  Within two days, I was moving pretty mobile, and then I launched into doing a lot of things to enhance recovery.  I wanted to talk to you a little bit about that too.  There are certain things that we know that you'd want to do going into the procedure, that I was very careful with to ensure that my own stem cells were are healthy and that I was healthy going into a procedure like that, being very careful with inflammation.  Eating extremely clean, consuming a lot of herbs and spices to enhance my own anti-inflammatory process, but also potentially, my own stem cell production with a lot of sirtuin enhancing foods like blueberries and dark vegetable powders and a lot of these things that are considered to be almost like Whole Food wild plant extracts that we see a lot of people here in Sardinia consuming.  I did a lot of infrared light therapy, I did a lot of pulsed electromagnetic field therapy, which has some actual interesting studies on it, in terms of your own endogenous stem cell production, but then for recovery, I continue to do a lot of those things, right?  PEMF and the Joovv Lights, continue to a lot of infrared, near and far, but when someone leaves your clinic after this full body stem cell makeover, do you have certain biohacks or techniques or protocols that you think allow them to get back into the game or to make the procedure all the more effective?

Dr. Adelson:  I keep it very simple.  I think I mostly tell people what not to do, and really what kills stem cells more than anything is alcohol.  I've just found that people who drink, I mean it really just crushes those stem cells.

Ben:  Now, we just got done saying though that in Sardinia, where people are living a long time, their drinking a moderate amount of alcohol each day.  I think I one to two glasses of wine, so when you say alcohol, do you mean no alcohol?

Dr. Adelson:  I mean specifically binge drinking because the Sardinians who are living to be these 120-year-old Sardinians are not binge drinking generally.  I mean there's a big difference between one drink a day and one drink an hour, but for the first it's definitely two weeks after stem cell therapy, I recommend no alcohol.  Two months is better.  It's not going to kill you to take a little time off alcohol.  Smoking is a big one, and then not overdoing it physically is a big one, and of course, you went and did a massive endurance race five days later or something which was against the medical advice.

Ben:  I broke the rules, I kinesiotaped myself and braced myself to the Hilton, went and raced in a Spartan, basically to keep my sponsors happy and fulfill my contractual obligations, but I was somewhat careful.  I raced gingerly if that can be done.

What about things like Myer's cocktails IVs.  I know you do those kind of things in the clinic.  Anything like that that you would do to enhance the recovery process?

Dr. Adelson:  I think those are great, the reality is the majority of our patients travel from out of state, and many of them are international, so I don't really have the luxury of doing a bunch of stuff.  I'm in the process of working with Dan Pompa who is a friend of yours and you've done quite a bit of work with and most of your listeners probably know who Dr. Dan Pompa.  We're in the process of putting together a protocol where it will be several, between two or three weeks leading up to the treatment, and then for several months after the treatments, and that's something we're working on right now.

Ben:  Give me a sneak peek.  Just drop a couple hints for me as to what would be involved with a program like that.

Dr. Adelson:  Well if Dan Pompa is involved, it's going to involve some fasting for sure, but at this point, I really do keep it simple.  What I was said earlier about the four pillars of health: diet, exercise, sleep and emotional balance and just really shoot for a B+ in all of them because a B+ in all four categories, you get a cumulative A.  I tend to keep it very simple 'cause people are going to do what they resonate with.  Sensually there's two types of people, there's people who aren't going to do anything even if I tell them to, so why bother telling them to do stuff, and then there's people who are already doing a lot of stuff, and they should just keep doing the stuff that they're doing.  If I was going to give one piece of advice and say listen to the Ben Greenfield Show.

Ben:  Oh, thanks, brother.  Appreciate that.  You're right, if Dan's involved, I guarantee fasting will be involved, and that's actually one of the better ways to induce longevity and enhance stem cell production.  I know Dan is very into, like I mentioned earlier, this concept of near-infrared and far-infrared.  I know he does a lot of sauna, so I wouldn't be surprised if that, from just a pure detoxification standpoint were included.  A couple of those that come to mind would be again, pulsed electromagnetic field therapy, which I'm using almost every day, I have a giant bed at home that I just lay on to enhance recovery, and then another would be water.  You mentioned exercise and food, what were your four pillars? Exercise, food, your spiritual state and sleep.  I guess water we could lump in there with food, and I know this concept that originally I was made aware of by Tyler Lebaron of the Molecular Hydrogen Foundation drinking hydrogen-rich water as an anti-inflammatory or as an antioxidant.  I think the last time I was with Dan, he was using the hydrogen-rich water pills.  I have to get one of those as well.

Dr. Adelson:  That's something that Gary Young was very interested.  Did you know Gary just died, did you hear?

Ben:  Yeah, Gary Young of Young Living Essential Oils.

Dr. Adelson:  Yeah, so sad.  What a great, great light we lost with him.  I'm so sad to see him go.

Ben:  And he was a hydrogen-rich water enthusiasts well.

Dr. Adelson:  He was big into hydrogen rich water.

Ben:  Yeah, and that's basically what I did.  I was fortunate to be staying at Dan's after I did your procedures, so I did a lot of little biohacks, but I've talked to some other people who've gone down to Park City where you're located.  They've done this full body stem cell makeover, arrived a day or two prior to make sure of their well slept and that some of the inflammation from airline travel had settled down, prior to arriving, and then afterwards, and stayed a couple of days, and that's what I also did 'cause I didn't want to get right on the plane after the procedure, and even just bringing giant suitcases of some of your best supplements, your best foods.  If you have things like infrared light, all these kind of things.  You guys have a hotel right across the street from the office.

Dr. Adelson:  Three hotels right next door to us.

Ben:  Is that pretty common, people go there and they just set up shop in the hotel across the street.

Dr. Adelson:  Yeah, there's a Holiday Inn Express to one side and then there's a chic boutique hotel, and the other New Park Resort.

Ben:  Perfect, if you're going to get the full body stem cell maker, you probably want something nicer than the Holiday Inn Express, out a mansion.

Dr. Adelson:  I think it's actually good.  People say it's quite nice, but the New Park, I think, has better reviews.

Ben:  I have a Holiday Inn Express near my house, and that's when film crews come in and folks come in, I'm comfortable with the Holiday Inn Express, so it's not bad.  Okay, so ultimately, all of the links in the resources for what Dr. Adelson and I have talked about are going to be over at bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover.

When I was under sedation, of course, Dr. Amy Killen came in and did the full cosmetic and sexual enhancement procedure that I won't force you to detail Harry.  I'll have her do it, but what you're going to hear next is what ensued after my full body stem cell makeover because, prior to you guys waking me up, I did quite a few other procedures overseen by Dr. Amy Killen and folks can come in and, correct me if I'm wrong, just do this one-two combo the same way that I did?

Dr. Adelson:  You bet.  Yeah, that's right.  A lot of people do it that way, so we have certain days that Amy's in the clinic, and if you want to have us both at the same time, we could schedule it at the same time, you come in then you add to that list of people to talk to.  Before the treatment, Amy is there, you go to sleep.  I do my thing, she does her thing.  Then you wake up after about three hours, and you have had everything imaginable in your body injected with stem cells and exosomes.

Ben:  Yeah, and that was honestly exactly what I did, and the thing I noticed the most right off the bat was the sexual enhancement piece of what Amy did.  I mean that was within two days.  The stem cells are still kicking in.  I was sore for a few days, and now, I'm beginning to feel as though all these old injuries are just of melting away, and my body feels amazing now, and I wake up in the mornings, and I think you told me would be what, two to six months to really feel all the benefits settling in?

Dr. Adelson:  I mean things, it's for the first two months, it's a bit of a roller coaster.  Sometimes people say they're a little bit worse, and then they'll have good days and bad days, but at about that two months mark is when the good, really the trend starts to be for the better.  Between month two and months six is where really the magic happens.  About six months, people tend to plateau, but then the benefit last for years, and anywhere from three to six years later, and I'm talking about for the treatment of pain.  I probably am going to hear from people again.

Ben:  Amazing.  Now I do feel a bit bad because I made you talk so much, Harry, that wonderful Italian espresso you ordered still sits cold in front of you, so you had a chance.  I was talking a few times.  You could have taken a shot of that bad boy, but anyways, like I mentioned you guys who are listening in, the second part of this interview will be with Dr. Amy Killen, and in addition to that, if this is something that you want done and you want to go to clinics in Park City Utah and fly in and have that Harry do this protocol for you.  First of all, I'll put links to his clinic and his contact details over at bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover, just like it sounds, stem cell makeover.  I'll put a video of both part one, my full body stem cell makeover with Dr. Harry as well as the sexual and cosmetic enhancement procedure with Dr. Amy as a video on the show notes for you to be able to access and watch if you like to sit back and walk surgeries for entertainment.  Skip the Netflix one evening and watch me getting injected by Dr. Harry and that's really about everything you're going to find the show notes, aside from some of the little biohacks that I did to myself to enhance recovery.  So I'll put all of that over there bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover, and Harry, as they are prone to say here in Italy, grazie and arrivederci.

Dr. Adelson:  Arrivederci.

Ben:  Alright, thanks for listening folks.

Hey, I want to interrupt today's show to tell you about the Joovv.  I mentioned it earlier when I introduced the podcast about how if you go to Runga, we're going to have Joovv lights there, but Joovv lights are basically photobiomodulation.  Photobiomodulation is one of the most well researched ways to increase your collagen production and your skin health, improve your sexual performance, if you shine it on your junk, increase your muscle recovery, reduce joint pain.  You can shine it on your thyroid, increased thyroid gland activity.  This thing is like having a light doctor in your house.  So what Joovv did was they built a whole bunch of FDA-approved electrostatic coded LED panels that deliver way more intensity, they passed some really rigorous third-party testing for these things.  They even built this brand new modular design that allows you to surround your whole body with Joovv lights.  You can also tie it into your Alexa or Google Home if you're one of those people, and you can just say, “Alexa, I want to Joovv for ten minutes,” and it'll just turn on, lets you Joovv.  You get the little one, the Joovv Mini, which my kids have, or you can step all the way up to the Joovv Elite which is what I have in my office.  This is one of the best ways to get muscle recovery, testosterone production, skin health, joint pain, inflammation.  I do a weekly clay mask on my face for beauty, and I shine the infrared light on my face while I had that mask on.  So many ways you can use this thing, it's like the ultimate biohack.

Anyways, you get to grab one and get a unique bonus along with it if you go to joovv.com/ben.  That's JOOVV.com/ben.  When you go there, they have a whole bunch of cool videos, scientific information and whole bunch of different models that you can scroll through and build.  They're pretty fun to shop for over there 'cause they have a Choose-Your-Own-Adventure way to build your own photobiomodulation unit, so check them out.  JOOVV.com/ben.

This podcast is also brought to you by Onnit.  They have Spider Man Battle Ropes over there, you heard me right.  Spider Man Battle Ropes, battle ropes give you an amazing work out, and the Spider Man Battle Ropes, they're forty feet long and made with three-strand polypropylene, super strong, super durable for your gym or for your health club or for your backyard you can swing it, you can slam it, you can flip it, you can spin it, anything you want to do.  They have a bunch of really good videos on how to do battle rope press and battle rope seated twist, lateral waves, alternating waves.  I have one of these in my basement gym.  I have harnessed it to the wall.  It is an amazing cardiovascular workout, really good for building power, good for an upper body workout especially if you're not a swimmer, for example.  You want to build cardiovascular endurance or muscular endurance in your upper body.  Onnit has a whole bunch of cool fitness equipment, but you've got to grab a Spider-Man battle rope, plus it's red and blue like Spider-Man, so you get 10% off that or anything else from Onnit.  Just go to bengreenfieldfitness.com/onnit.  That's begreenfieldfitness.com/ONNIT.

Ben:  Hey folks, what's up?  It's Ben Greenefield and I am back.  You actually just heard me interview Dr. Harry Adelson about the full body stem cell makeover that he did on me, but his partner in crime is now with me on this show, on this part two of this episode.  So her name is Dr. Amy Killen, we actually haven't seen each other since we were both at A-Fest in Sardinia, Italy teaching at a longevity course there for this company called Mind Valley.  But even prior to that, Amy, while I was under, I guess was it sedation or anesthesia, Amy?

Dr. Killen:  It was moderate sedation, so a light anesthesia.

Ben:  Yeah, well I was out cold, and Amy did some cutting edge procedures on me that were kind of complimentary to what Dr. Adelson did.  She is the person to go to here in the US when it comes to cosmetic and sexual enhancement, using not only stem cells, but a lot of these other protocols including things like PRP.  She's done some things with exosomes as well, so she's going to fill us in on what ensued after Dr. Adelson did the complete stem cell injection of my entire musculoskeletal system.  Now again you can go visit bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover.  That's bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover to access the show notes and everything else that we talk about and also to be able to visit the clinic.  Amy's program is called Docere Medical, and she is an MD.  She actually graduated at the top 10% of her class.  She took to medical school at U.T. Southwestern, and she did her residency in emergency medicine at University of Arizona, and somehow pivoted, I want to hear a little bit more about this, from emergency medicine into injecting people's genitals and faces and lines, and so how exactly did the transition happen, Amy?

Dr. Killen:  That's a good question, so I did ER for about 10 years.  I was an ER doctor.  Toward the last few years of that, I had my three kids in the course of about two years, and I was working super crazy 4 a.m. shifts in the ER, was sleeping about two hours a night, was using a lot of sleeping pills and caffeine and just overloaded and stressed, and I started realizing that I need to start taking better care of myself.  At the same time, I was seeing patients.  They were coming in over and over again for the same kinds of medical problems.  So I became very interested in preventative medicine and eventually, started learning about preventive medicine and integrated medicine, and then that segued into regenerative medicine which is sort of a stem cell medicine and getting your own body to heal itself.  So it was a journey that took place over several years, but it was my dissatisfaction with both my own health and my patient's health.

Ben:  Your job now seems a lot cooler.

Dr. Killen:  It is super cool, yeah.

Ben:  More interesting than the gun and knife club in the emergency room.  I used to do a lot of volunteering in the emergency room in undergrad, and it was actually not super exciting because this was in Moscow, Idaho, so it was more people coming in after having had too many beers or someone got their toe run over by the car or something like that, but there wasn't a lot going on in terms of very interesting accidents, so it's probably a good thing.  Anyways though, so when Dr. Adelson finished up on me, walk me through a little bit of what you did, and obviously we'll rabbit hole bit here, but I believe one of the primary things that you had access to in those giant needles and syringes that you were injecting into me was PRP, but you're mixing that with certain things.  So get into PRP and how that differs from stem cells and what you're up to when it comes to your approach for sexual enhancement and cosmetic enhancement.

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, so I use PRP.  Platelet-Rich Plasma is what PRP is, and I just take some of your own blood, centrifuge it and get the platelets concentrated so that there's a high level of platelets in a small amount of serum because the platelets house these growth factors which then are like signaling molecules, like fertilizer almost to your own stem cells.

Ben:  Now how are those different than exosomes, the growth factors?

Dr. Killen:  It's a good question, they're little different.  Exosomes come directly from the stem cells, so exosomes come from umbilical stem cells or from your own stem cells, and they're like these little messenger bubbles that carry not just proteins from the stem cells but also some messenger RNA and micro-RNA which are like the blueprints for making proteins.  So the exosomes have a little bit more information.  PRP is coming from your platelets and not from the stem cells themselves, but the platelets, they're responsible for healing.  So for instance, if you cut your arm, platelets are one of the first responders, and they cause the clotting of the wound, but then they also send out signals that say hey, we need to get some more blood vessels in here 'cause we broke some we need some.  The nerves you need to fix, get fixed.  The collagen needs to get fixed, so the platelets begin that healing cascade no matter which part of your body they're placed in.  So we can use the platelets in conjunction with things like stem cells and exosomes, and they all work together in different ways to create this cool regenerative process.

Ben:  So this would be another way to, I think Dr. Adelson calls it upgrading your stem cells when you combine it with exosomes.  You would then combine the stem cells with with PRP, but then you also throw exosomes in there as well?

Dr. Killen:  I do, yeah.  I do all of them, and you know every case is different.  Sometimes, we'll just do PRP, sometimes we'll do PRP with stem cells or with exosomes or all three, depends on what we're working to achieve as well as what the patient is interested in paying for honestly, but they all work in different ways and they all could be really cool ways to get your own body to help heal itself.

Ben:  So unless you weren't able to afford exosomes, because from what I understand, those are the crem dela crem, the more expensive.  You could still take your stem cells and combine those with PRP and get that upgraded cell signaling effect.

Dr. Killen:  Yeah definitely, and you can even just do people PRP by itself.  You know usually it takes several more treatments with PRP alone to get some of the same results that you would get from exosomes or stem cells.  So we no, for instance, musculoskeletal literature, you have to get several PRP injections over the course of several months to even approach the kinds of effects you would get from just a single stem cell treatment.  So the same is true in on the things that I do, but PRP does work.  You may do it more than one time.

Ben:  Okay, from what I understand the stem cells stay in the joint, and based on the stem cell theory of aging that Dr Adelson laid out in the previous interview, they're there for your body to call upon for a longer period of time after you've had the procedure done, whereas the growth factors from PRP.  They're in the joint for a little while, they do their job, but they're not necessarily in your body for a long time which is why you need repeated injections if you did PRP without some cell?

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, you know what's interesting about that is with the penis shot, for instance the P-shot, there's some studies that show that if you inject stem cells into the penis, into those vesicles, the tubes that flow with blood, they'll stay in there for a few days, but they eventually, those stem cells that you injected make their way into other parts of the body like into the bone marrow of the patient or into the lymphatic system where they set up shop.  So what appears to be happening is if the main benefit of the stem cells that were given are actually the messaging component of those stem cells, so those stem cells, at least in the procedures that I do, probably don't stick around all that long, for more than a few days in that tissue, but in those few days, they start sending out these messages, and then they go somewhere else in your body and they can still send messages and still be active.

Ben:  Okay, so let's start there, with the corpus cavernosum.  How many times did you inject my penis with PRP?

Dr. Killen:  I injected it five times, and it was PRP and exosomes that I was using.

Ben:  Okay, so tell me why a guy would do that, and also I know there's a one called the O-shot.  I want to get into how this works for females as well 'cause my wife actually recently did her clitoris and her vagina, and that was with stem cells and I believe PRP mixed in with that, but walk me through this P-shot first, like how it works and what you're trying to achieve with it.

Dr. Killen:  So we numb it up first because you are asleep, but a lot people are awake.

Ben:  Thank goodness I was asleep.

Dr. Killen:  We just use some topical numbing cream, and it works pretty well actually, but we numb it.  We do you two injections on each side.  The corpus cavernosum are again, those tubes that fill with blood when you get an erection.  So we're injecting directly into those tubes, and then I do another injection at the corona which is the ring that's the tip of the penis.  So I do those five areas, and what we see in animal and human research is that there's increases in things like blood vessel development over the course of the next few months, increases in nerve regeneration, improvements in things like nitric oxide levels in the tissue.  So basically all of that means that you can have a good improvements in things like sensitivity and firmness of erections and ability to get an erection and staying power of erections, so you're regenerating or improving or repairing what you have already there.

Ben:  Yeah, and I actually have done it awake.  I've done stem cells awake and just on the nerve block prior, and this was far more pleasant to do it under sedation.

Dr. Killen:  But it's not that bad.  It's not as bad as you say.

Ben:  I think it’s ironic that you actually have to get injected with your penis with the numbing agent, prior to actually getting injected 'cause the initial injection.  In my opinion, it's uncomfortable, but I actually thought, before I got injected the first time that it was actually done in through the urethra.  I thought you just go in through the hole in the front and inject it with something.  That's just my base understanding of anatomy and my flawed concept of how this works.  So you did the corpus cavernosum, you do the head of the penis and basically what you're going after is better erections, longer orgasms, better sexual performance.  Did you also do this for guys with ED or Peyronie's?

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, definitely, so have a lot of patients who have some degree of erectile dysfunction, whether it's from diabetes or high blood pressure or just age-related or other post-prostatectomy patients.  So we'll do the injections for them.  Peyronie's, there's also some good evidence that's coming out now that shows that PRP and probably stem cells can be helpful for Peyronie's which is like a scarring disease where you get curvature of the penis, and it can be painful, so we use it for all of those things, and then I'll oftentimes do the shockwave therapy, the GainsWave therapy or something like that along with these treatments because they work really well together.

Ben:  Yeah, I've gotten the GainsWave done a few times as well, so you actually do that in conjunction to almost drive home the PRP?

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, what I actually do in all my patients now who are getting the P-shot.  We didn't do with you because I didn't have the machine then, but I do a single GainsWave or shockwave therapy treatment session right before doing that P-shot because you're creating this sheer stress or micro-trauma to the tissue, and then you're injecting the growth factors right afterwards, and it makes sense to me that those growth factors are going to know where to go, and it creates faster change if you do the shockwave first.  So I do shockwave first, follow the P-shot, and then patients, I tell them to go back wherever they're from, and then follow it up with GainsWave series or shockwave therapy series of six to  X number of treatments in the coming weeks and months, depending on how bad their dysfunction is.

Ben:  And do you have just a machine at the Park City location, or are you operating elsewhere also?

Dr. Killen:  I have to another clinic down in South Salt Lake which is a big integrated medicine practice.  So I have GainsWave there, we do a lot of GainsWave procedures down there.  We do hormones and naturopathic medicine and sports medicine, all kinds of stuff down there, so it's sort of a bigger, more integrated approach down there, and in Park City, I do that all the stem cell stuff.

Ben:  Okay, now how about women?  How's the O-shot work?  And by the way, what does O stand for in O-shot 'cause the P stands for penis.  I'm still trying to figure out what O stands for.

Dr. Killen:  The O stands for orgasm, which is a great name, of course.  Basically it's the same thing, it's PRP at least, and I will oftentimes add other things to it like the stem cells or the exosomes, but injections into the clitoris and into the interior vaginal wall, kind of where the G-spot is, the upper part of the vagina, which is also where the urethra is, which is the tube that drains your bladder when you're urinating.  So we can see improvements in things like stress incontinence, which when you have to pee a little bit when you're jumping, as well as improvements in things like orgasms during pleasure and sensation and lubrication and vaginal tightness and all that good stuff.

Ben:  Have you ever had the injection done yourself?

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, I have.

Ben:  What's it feel like 'cause my wife has a pretty high pain tolerance, and when I saw her get the stem cells, PRP injected 'cause I watched the procedure.  She was grimacing, seemed pretty painful, but I'm just curious.  For me, it was just this really uncomfortable pressure, like a strange pressure sensation.

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, for me, the vaginal injection was kind of a crampy feeling like I've had before but like this kind of public cramp the just lasted a few minutes.  I had this done when I was learning how to do the procedure myself, so it was other doctors who were learning as well.

Ben:  That's always what you want, someone guinea pigging on your genitals.

Dr. Killen:  I know, and it's a whole group, too, so there were five of them, and one of them was performing and the other ones were watching, and so it was very weird.

Ben:  Go out for drinks afterwards or pretend it didn't happen.

Dr. Killen:  But the clitoral injection was actually a little bit painful because they didn't give me the numbing cream for very long because we were in a hurry that day, and so I felt like it was more painful than it usually is for my patients, just because it didn't have time to numb.  So it was a five minutes of pain kind of thing, but most of my patients now, we give them a lot of time to numb, and it's really not uncomfortable for I would say 90% of people.

Ben:  Okay, so basically is it two injections then?  You're doing the labia and the clitoris?

Dr. Killen:  You're doing the clitoris and then the inside, just inside the vagina, at the top.  So two injections, sometimes I'll do more injections in people who have a lot of vaginal dryness and they want several injections or they have likened sclerosis which is a scarring disorder.  We can do more injections, you can put these.  You can put this PRP and stem cells in any number of places, but the traditional O-shot is just two injections.

Ben:  Okay, got it.  Now you also, speaking of sexual enhancement for women or cosmetic enhancement, you also do this thing called the Vampire.  What exactly is the vampire?

Dr. Killen:  So the vampire facial and face lift are PRP for the face, where we are either injecting PRP or we're doing it topically with micro kneeling and we did both of those on you, and what I do oftentimes again is I'll do the PRP, and I'll add other things.  I'll add the exosomes or the stem cells to it.  I'm doing injections all over the face, and I'm also doing a micro needling.  So I'm getting the upper layers of the skin and the lower layers of skin as well.

Ben:  Okay, so when you're doing, for example, the face or you're doing the breast, what exactly is happening from a biological level when you're injecting those areas?

Dr. Killen:  So with the face for instance you're injecting PRP or some cells and what happens over the course of the next few weeks is that it tells your own stem cells in your skin to increase collagen productions.  So collagen is important for the structure of your skin, and we all start losing it at about age 25, so that's kind of scary.  So increases collagen production, increases elastin which gives your skin bounce back, and also increases hyaluronic acid which is what gives your skin that moist, youthful appearance.  So all of those things are components that start to go down as you age, and again, aging starts at about 25, as far as your skin is concerned.  So these are ways to give your skin improvements in texture and tone and color and just vibrancy, glow, things like that.

Ben:  Okay, so does it kick in right away because, for example, I am now about three and half months out from my procedure with Dr. Adelson, and I've noticed profound improvements in my workout recovery, first of all, and then also, I've been getting a lot of comments on my face.  I mean that started even just two weeks after the procedure where you did.  So it was micro needling, PRP, stem cells and exosomes in my face?

Dr. Killen:  Yes.  Yeah, we did all of those things in your face.  They could start within a couple of weeks.  It's immediate where the signalling starts, but it's really about two weeks out that we start to actually see patients saying that they are feeling better about their skin, and you'll continue to have more and more benefits out through about six months, and then that will just stick with you for usually a year or two.

Ben:  And so tell me a little more about, for the women, the Vampire Breast Lift?

Dr. Killen:  So the breast lift, I don't do as many of those.  I've done them before.  I don't find that PRP is as good for volume, for adding volume to something as it is for improving the skin itself, so I've done it before.  It's not my favorite procedure honestly, but some people do it where you're basically taking PRP, and you're injecting that into the breast, and you're trying to increase the volume of the breasts in those areas and maybe even increase, improve the skin texture and tone and things like that.

Ben:  Yeah, I think that's what Kim Kardashian did.  She did a Vampire face lift, but then I think she did the breast lift as well.  I don't know if she used the exosomes, but I'm pretty sure she did platelet-rich plasma, which is like the lower hanging fruit and more common procedure, right?

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, the PRP procedures, I mean you can find them all over the place, and there are a lot of people doing them.  They've been around for several years, and you get the other facial injections, the O-shot, the P-shot, the Vampire Breast and the hair, within the hair regeneration, and then what we've done is we've started adding additional things to the PRP, which we're finding are actually really helpful and just give you way more benefit.

Ben:  Like what?

Dr. Killen:  Well the exosomes and the stem cells, and then we've also done some work with ozone or adding ozone to the PRP which is something else we've been experimenting with, so we're always looking for new ways to make these things more effective.

Ben:  How does the ozone work?

Dr. Killen:  So ozone, well you can actually ozonate the PRP before you inject it, so you're just adding this oxygen to it.  There's a lot of research in ozone for all kinds of things, inflammatory disorders and chronic disorders, and you can give it IV or you can give it topically.  There's all different ways to do it, but what we've been doing just recently is adding ozone to the PRP.  So you're basically giving even more healing powers to that PRP before you inject it, so it's not a different procedure.  It's just a different way of preparing the PRP.

Ben:  Okay, got it.  So in terms of the hair part of things, is there actual research that shows that or have you observed in the patients you've injected as far as the hairline is concerned that you actually get restoration of hair growth or a staving off of hair loss.  What exactly happens in that scenario?  Because a lot of people want to maintain that full head of hair.

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, so there is actually a fair amount of research with PRP.  There's less so with stem cells.  There are a couple of studies with stem cells and exosomes, but most of us with PRP that show that you have to have some hair follicles, so if you're totally bald and you've been bald for five years in an area, then probably injecting PRP in stem cells is not going to be effective.  You'll probably need a hair transplant, but if you have some hair, whether it's thinner or just more sparsely located on your head, then if you do PRP and then other things as well like the stem cells and exosomes what they found in studies is you tend to get between 18 and 33 new hairs per centimeter.  So if you add that to your whole head, it actually can make a pretty big difference.  With the PRP studies, they generally want you to do several treatments, so usually it's three treatments over the course of three months with PRP to see those benefits.  We are starting to see some better benefits with exosomes, but we've only been doing that for a few months.  So the jury's still out on how much better they are than PRP, but I think that they're better.

Ben:  Okay, now do you have an opinion on the type of stem cells that are going to be efficacious for a procedure like this, because there's this concept of autologous stem cells where you're taking the bone marrow aspirate that you guys use with me.  I have my fat stem cells stored with the U.S. Stem Cell Clinic, and I've certainly done those intravenously and into joints, and I've gotten umbilical amniotic in my back before, and also seen of course some of the data on placental cells.  There's exosomes, there's even these new things called V-cells which I'm currently researching a little bit, but which one is the best?  I mean it seems like the opinions vary widely out there in terms of what type of stem cells are the most efficacious?

Dr. Killen:  The opinions vary quite widely, and part of the question is what are you using them for?  So there's a lot of differences in opinion on that.  I don't think we know yet honestly.  I mean, there are studies that look at different types of stem cells, and they seem to be effective for different types of things, but there aren't studies so far, at least in the things that I do, the skin, the hair, the sexual stuff.  There aren't studies that compare one type of stem cell versus another, versus another, versus PRP and do things like that.  So it's mostly, at this point, just making sure that they're safe than they seem to be, and then keeping track of patient information and patient data as we go and seeing what's working the best for people.  So our approach right now is to do multiple things for each patient, exosomes, the fat drive stem cells or the bone marrow cells or the PRP, combining a few of those things because they all seem to have benefit, but we don't know for sure honestly what the best course is for any given treatment for patients.

Ben:  Those are vary based on what your goals are, like longevity and a full intravenous injection versus joints, versus say cosmetic or sexual?

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, I think it does.  It also varies depending on the patient's health.  Obviously, if you're like an eighty-year-old man and you're not very healthy and you have a lot of chronic medical problems, then taking your stem cells and putting them somewhere else in your body is going to be less effective than using someone else's healthier some cells.  Umbilical stem cells or exosomes from umbilical cells, so that makes sense obviously, but we just don't know for sure what's the best if you're a 25 year old or 30 year old or 40 year old healthy guy.  Where is the best way to get cells?

Ben:  Yeah, have you banked yours?

Dr. Killen:  I have not yet, it's one of those things that I want to do, and I don't know why I haven't because I work in the industry.  So I really should, I need to get harried to do.  I had liposuction one time.  I've had stem cells for my face before, when I was first doing this, and the liposuction, I was pretty bruised and battered afterwards 'cause they take fat out of your love handle area, and so I just remember kind of sore for so long that I haven't had it done again, but most people are as sore as I was, so I just need to suck it up and do it.

Ben:  Yeah, talk to my wife.  She got it done.  They actually didn't do her muffin top 'cause she doesn't really have one.  She's got Skinny Montana rancher jeans, but they did her thighs, and she had trouble walking for a few days because they have to do quite a bit of liposuction, but she stored hers at the same time that she stored them, got them extracted, one injection vagina and clitoris, combined with the PRP, and now she's got the rest banked for if she gets in a car accident or gets a concussion and needs to inject him intravenously or something like that, so it seems like a prudent way to go, especially if you are young and have young stem cells available.  What about these V-cells?  Do you know anything about them, these pro-gender cells that are called V-cells that apparently act like a stem cell?

Dr. Killen:  I just started learning about them.  I know a doctor, Matt Cook, who is doing a lot of work with those right now.

Ben:  Yeah, Matt's actually who I was talking with on the phone about.

Dr. Killen:  Oh, yeah.  I've actually talked to Matt a lot, too, about maybe working together on some projects, but yeah, I'm really interested in the V-cells and the idea being that they are able to develop even into more types of tissue and they're more flexible in what they can do, so that these early, early, early stem cells that can be found in the blood.  So you don't actually have to do a liposuction, so I haven't used them or done anything with them yet, but I am very interested in them.

Ben:  Yeah, me too, and probably I think he's in the San Jose area or the Bay Area.  I'll probably go visit him at some point and learn a little bit more about those or do a podcast about those with him, for those who are listening in and want to learn a bit more about these V-cells.  All sorts of these new cells people are finding.  I think ultimately, the cool thing about exosomes and these V-cells is that there's less of a need to go in and harvest your own stem cells, that are just yes basically cell signalling molecules or progenitor cells that work without having to go through the stem cell extraction process.

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, it's definitely easier if you can just get the cell there from your blood or purchase the cells that are already cryo-preserved 'cause it's a procedure.  Whether it's bone marrow or liposuction, it's a procedure, you're sore.  There's always very small risks of whatever, bruising and infection, things like that, but I think going forward, it's better for patients if we can use these other ways of using stem cells, and hopefully, eventually, it'll become more economical as well and not quite as expensive as it is now.

Ben:  So I want to ask you a little post-treatment care, too.  In terms of getting the most out of a procedure or enhancing the effects the best, are there best practices because I know that you guys will do these to enhance recovery.  Certainly myself, I used you know photobiomodulation and these Joovv lights to do near and far infrared on the face.  There's this concept of fasting to enhance endogenous stem cell production and also increase the viability of the stem cells that have been injected.  Do you have any tried-in-two practices or even biohacks that you would recommend or use yourself if you're going to get this kind of procedure done?

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, I mean if possible in the weeks beforehand, at least to do things like nitric oxide boosters.  Neo 40 or other nitric oxide boosters to increase your own nitric oxide because that nitric oxide really important for stem cell functioning.

Ben:  So to interrupt you real quick, going into a GainsWave or going into PRP or stem cell injection into the genitals, you would take things that would increase nitric oxide, like natural forms of Viagra like wheat and nitric oxide precursors?

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, I mean certainly for erectile dysfunction or improving erections, nitric oxide, as we know, is key, but it's actually important for all different areas your body and for just general stem cell activation, so I think if you can do nitric oxide boosters in the weeks and even months before doing a procedure like this, then you're going to have better results from the procedure, or other things.  Certainly I'm a fan of the light therapy, the low level light therapy of different varieties.  Afterwards, I think for the cosmetics, it can be helpful, especially for things like bruising and such can be helpful for that.  Intermittent fasting beforehand can be a good way to increase stem cell activity and release of stem cells, so I have some patients who definitely will do intermittent fasting for on and off, in the weeks beforehand, and then most of my patients don't smoke, but if they did, I actually probably wouldn't do procedures on them, but avoiding smoking, avoiding alcohol for at least a few days, but better a few weeks afterwards is really important.

Ben:  Okay, got it.  A few things that I was looking into in terms of recovery, have you ever seen this NanoVi DNA repair device?  It's basically like a desktop device in which you breathe water that generates reactive oxygen species.  I did a podcast on that.

Dr. Killen:  I have seen it, yeah.  I don't know much about it, but I've seen the commercial for it, I think.

Ben:  Yeah, I use it every day, and so I use that quite a bit.  I did the infrared light a lot, these Joovv infrared lights.  Have you used hydrogen-rich water before or heard of hydrogen-rich water?

Dr. Killen:  I have heard of it, yeah.  I haven't used it in patients, but I have, I know about it.

Ben:  The antioxidant and the anti-inflammatory results from that are a pretty profound.  I did a podcast on that as well, and there's some pretty interesting research on that and also on PEMF in stem cells.  I didn't know this until I started looking into it, but some of the first PEMF devices were actually created for NASA for stem cell enhancement.

Dr. Killen:  I did not know that.  Yeah, there's so much cool stuff that you could do to increase your own stem cells and their activity even if you're not having a procedure done.  Even exercise, that's simple stuff that could increase your stem cell activity and can then make these kind of procedures even better if you have them at some point.

Ben:  Yeah, it's pretty cool how much you can enhance, either the surgical repair and recovery process or even your ability to be able to enhance the effects going in using things like those nitric oxide precursors you're talking about.  I think a lot of people just go under the knife or go in for a procedure and don't think about what they're doing going into it, but there's a lot of things that you can do to enhance recovery and also to just enhance the efficacy of the procedure before you can go in.  And I wanted to ask you about that as well, if people want to actually go do this, the cosmetic enhancement or the sexual enhancement.  How exactly does that work?  I mean, is there like this big waiting line?  Do people just go to your website?  Do they call you on the phone?  I mean what's the best way for people who actually want to go in to get needles stuck into their genitals to proceed?

Dr. Killen:  All those people out there who want needles in the genitals, they could just give us a call at the clinic at Docere Clinics or Docere Medical.  Go to the website, Docere Medical, which is DOCEREmedical.com, and I also have my own Dr. Amy Killen website which has links to all my other practices and phone numbers and all that.  Basically, we always have the patient set up a phone consult with me first, and we go over the procedures and goals and expectations and that kind of thing, and then we get on the schedule, and it depends on how far out we're booked, but usually, we can get you in within a month or so, and that's it.  We just do it all in one day.  A lot of patients will combine procedures with Dr. Harry Adelson like you said, so they'll do the joint injections and the cosmetic and sexual stuff with me, all under one big procedure.  So you're sleep for a couple hours and you get all the things injected, and you wake up and you're good to go.

Ben:  Awesome, well I'm going to link to all this stuff over bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover, so to summarize this for you guys, basically the procedure that I did, this full body stem cell makeover started with Harry, who basically did the full musculoskeletal with stem cells, PRP and exosomes, and then he turned things over to Amy.  She did cosmetic, she did sexual, she did hairline and everything else that you've just learned about.  So essentially, how long was in there, Amy?  It was about four hours.

Dr. Killen:  Yeah, three hours under sedation, and then a little bit to wake up afterwards.

Ben:  Yeah, I mean to warn those of you who do this, you're kind of beat up for a few days.  I would recommend if you travel to Salt Lake or to Park City to do this,, you throw in some buffer time, not only because flying can be inflammatory and probably not the best way to recover right after you've done the procedure, but you want some down time, and I know there's hotels across the street from the clinic.  I personally just stayed at a friend's house there and did some easy walks out in the sunshine, in the forest, out there back, behind Park City, but ultimately, plan on flying out, perhaps one or two days early, so you're able to mitigate some of the inflammatory flex of flying before you go in for the procedure, and then plan on sticking around a couple days after to allow your body to repair and recover because I was sore.  I was hobbling the next day.

Dr. Killen:  But you did a Spartan race five days later, this is not advisable.

Ben:  Heavily against doctor's orders, I went on a ninety-minute hike, in the afternoon, the day after the procedure.  I went to the gym and did a weight training routine two days later, and then I raced a Spartan five days later.  I do not recommend that particular approach, but I tend to push the envelope.  So, in an ideal scenario, you would give yourself some R&R.  So, ultimately though, that's your decision, folks, and I have a lot of other hard charging high achievers who listen in, but I think that in an ideal scenario, I would have recovered and rested a little bit more, but ultimately, I feel great.  I mean, this is far from the procedure, and now it's kind of cool because my wife's done the O-shot, so we're all adults here, so we can talk about this, but our sex right now is fantastic because her orgasms are longer, my orgasms are longer.  We're both more primed, we both have way more blood flow.  I mean, there are so many benefits if you have a partner, you go do this with.  I know it's expensive, I know it's better living through science, but man oh man, it's fun to play around with the stuff.  Amy, anything else you want to share with folks before we part ways here?

Dr. Killen:  I don't think so , thank you so much for having me.  This has been really fun, and it has been great having you as a patient and hearing about your journey during all of this.

Ben:  Awesome, thanks.  Well folks, if you want to go see the videos of the entire procedure in nitty-gritty detail on YouTube, on my YouTube channel, I'll put a link to that.  I'll put a link to the Docere Clinics and everything else that we talked about, all the recovery biohacks that I used, all of the information that you need to get this done yourself if you also want to, to use the term again, engage in a little better living through science.  This is one of the most cutting edge ways to upgrade your entire body, so go to bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover.  That's bengreenfieldfitness.com/stemcellmakeover, I'll have everything there, and Amy, thanks for coming on.

Dr. Killen:  Thank you, have a great day.



Note from Ben regarding the Full Body Stem Cell Makeover: I mentioned 30K as total cost on the podcast. That actually is the cost for all the stem cell and exosome injections into the spine and joints. The *cosmetic* and *sexual* add-ons tack 12-15K onto the total cost of this procedure. Just a heads up!

What you are about to discover in this podcast is one of the most advanced, fringe, cutting-edge biohacks and forays into self-experimentation I’ve ever done…

…a full body stem-cell makeover at Docere Clinics in Park City, Utah…including a little-known type of compound called an “exosome”.

Dr. Harry Adelson, my first guest on today’s podcast, was one of the early adopters of stem cell therapy for the treatment of pain. He began his training in regenerative injection therapy (prolotherapy) in 1998 while in his final year at The National College of Naturopathic Medicine, in Portland, Oregon after having been cured of a rock-climbing injury with prolotherapy. During his residency program in Integrative Medicine at the Yale/Griffin Hospital in Derby, Connecticut, he volunteered after hours in a large homeless shelter in Bridgeport, Connecticut, providing regenerative injection therapies to the medically underserved while gaining valuable experience. He opened Docere Clinics in Park City in 2002 and from day one, his practice has been 100% regenerative injection therapies for the treatment of musculoskeletal pain conditions. In 2006 he incorporated platelet-rich plasma and ultrasound-guided injection into his armamentarium, in 2010, bone marrow aspirate concentrate and adipose-derived stem cells, and in 2013, fluoroscopic-guided injection (motion X-ray).

Since February of 2010, Dr. Adelson has performed over 5,000 bone marrow and adipose-derived adult stem cell procedures and has injected stem cells into over 500 intervertebral discs, placing him among those most experienced in the world with the use of autologous stem cells for the treatment of musculoskeletal pain conditions.

Dr. Amy Killen is also a guest on today’s show. She joined Docere Medical after moving to Utah from Portland, Oregon, where she was the Medical Director of an anti-aging and regenerative medicine specialty practice. Dr. Killen’s medical training began in Dallas, where she attended medical school at UT Southwestern and received her M.D. degree, graduating in the top 10% of her class. She completed a residency in Emergency Medicine at the University of Arizona and served as Chief Resident during her final year. After working as a board-certified emergency physician for more than 7 years, Dr. Killen began studying and training in anti-aging, regenerative, and aesthetic medicine in hopes of approaching patients’ wellness and beauty from a different perspective and with a new toolbox of innovative and effective treatment options.

Advanced training has included completion of the fellowship in Anti-Aging and Regenerative Medicine through the American Association of Anti-Aging Medicine and certification training in Age Management Medicine. Dr. Killen is certified by the National Institute of Medical Aesthetics in both basic and advanced cosmetic injections and trained with Dr. Lisbeth Roy to learn the O-Shot and P-Shot PRP procedures. Further PRP injection training was provided by PRP Life Lift and she completed the Hair Coach certification program with Dr. Alan Bauman in Florida, which taught a comprehensive approach to non-surgical hair loss. Dr. Killen learned how to extract and process stem cells as part of the U.S. Stem Cell Training Course taught by leading stem cell scientist Dr. Kristin Comella. Dr. Amy Killen has also spent many hours in the operating suite learning directly from Harry Adelson N.D. at Docere Clinics.


Bottom of Form

Top of Form

Bottom of Form

Dr. Killen has spoken nationally about PRP and stem cell therapies and teaches a physician training course for ApexBiologix outlining current best practices for using regenerative therapies in aesthetics and sexual optimization.

During my discussion with Harry and Amy, you’ll discover:

-How Harry got started with prolotherapy and PRP for pain management in farmers and construction workers…14:45

-The “Stem Cell Theory of Aging”, which states that biologic aging is a result of loss function and population of stem cells in musculoskeletal tissues…24:00

-How Harry is harvesting stem cells from bone marrow, supplementing them with exosomes (the “currency” of stem cells, the inter-cellular communication blocks), and then injecting them into all major moving parts as well as skin of face, scalp, and penis…28:30

-Why umbilical and amniotic stem cells could potentially be dangerous due to exposing the body to foreign DNA…32:30

-What “MSC’s” are, why are they different and better than other stem cell therapies, and how they differentiate into musculoskeletal tissues and have been called “medical signaling cells” because they trigger the healing of damaged tissues…42:00

-Why somebody would undergo a full body stem cell treatment, and whether is it going to “rejuvenate all of the cells in my body”…49:30

-What to expect after a full body stem cell makeover…57:00

Interview with Dr. Amy Killen:

-What PRP therapy is, and how it differs from stem cells…1:07:00

-What happens when you inject stem cells into a man’s “unit”, and why Amy injected Ben…1:11:30

-Why Amy injects stem cells and PRP into vaginas, and how the O-Shot improves the power and duration of female orgasms…1:15:20

-The secrets of the vampire breast lift and other cosmetic procedures she has done…1:18:15

-What causes hair loss, and how to fix it with stem cells…1:22:15

-What V-cells are and how they work…1:27:00

-Post-treatment care and biohacks to enhance recovery and efficacy of the treatment…1:29:00

-And much more!

Resources from this episode:

Docere Clinics in Park City, Utah

-Video: What Are Exosomes? Ben Greenfield Interviews Dr. Harry Adelson On Full Body Stem Cell Makeover

-Video: Ben Greenfield Interviews Dr. Amy Killen About Stem Cells, PRP, Exosomes & P-Shot

-Video: Ben Greenfield Full Body Stem Cell Makeover With Exosomes: Part 1

-Video: Ben Greenfield Full Body Stem Cell Makeover With Exosomes: Part 2

-All the recovery biohacks I implemented to recover from the stem cell procedures and enhance stem cell production:

Flexpulse PEMF
Pulsecenters PEMF
Biomat Infrared
Water and Wellness Molecular Hydrogen
Joovv Infrared Light
NanoVi DNA Repair
Exogenous HVMN Ketones
Omega-3 DHA Superessential Fish Oil
Vielight Photobiomodulation
Kion Flex
Clearlight Sauna

Episode Sponsors

Runga Join me for an amazing week at Runga. It’s one of the most amazing weeks of my year. Use discount code “ben” to secure the one last minute reservation that just became available.

Kion Lean Support for normal blood sugar levels and healthy energy metabolism, even after large, carb-rich meals.

Baruka Nuts Get 15% off your order when you use my link and get a couple of travel packs on the house if you sign up for a subscription.

Joovv Next-Level Light Therapy. See how Joovv can help you reach—and surpass—your health and fitness goals.

Onnit Engineered for peak performance, Onnit is the easiest way to get optimized.

Ask Ben a Podcast Question

3 thoughts on “[Transcript] – The Single, Most Comprehensive Stem Cell Procedure Known To Humankind: How A “Full Body Stem Cell & Exosome Makeover” Works.

  1. CSue says:

    The Docere website now says this:

    PLEASE NOTE – Due to recent developments in the regulatory environment, we are currently phasing out our use of adipose-derived stem cells and plan to totally discontinue its use by November 2020.

    Pretty major development. How does this affect everything they are doing?

  2. Barbara merrigan says:

    Hi Ben, I just listened to your interview on episode 5 of Pain Revealed. I live in the Denver area and am wondering if you know of anybody reputable that is doing stem cell/exosome therapy in Colorado?

    I have a labrum tear and bone loss in my hip. I don’t want a hip replacement….! Thanks for any guidance…..

    1. Closest I've been to is Dr Harry Adelson in Park City, UT. You might post this to the Kion Community: Facebook.com/groups/GetKion/

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *