January 4, 2020
[00:00:45] About This Podcast
[00:01:44] Podcast Sponsors
[00:06:53] My Mysterious Guest
[00:08:04] Background and Interest in These Biohacks
[00:11:28] Changing the Gravitational Pull Inside Your Cells to Speed Up the Healing Process
[00:20:00] Immortalis Probiotic
[00:22:53] How the Klotho Protein Is Activated and Suppressed
[00:32:15] Ways to Protect from Harmful 5G Technology
[00:34:09] Podcast Sponsors
[00:36:49] cont. Ways to Protect from Harmful 5G Technology
[00:44:31] The Skinny On V-Cells
[00:58:01] A Mostly Unknown Way to Boost NAD Levels
[01:03:53] A Natural Way to Upregulate Endothelial Stem Cells
[01:07:42] Interesting Biohacks Related to Water
[01:18:03] A Device That Increases the Mineral Density of Plants
[01:27:37] Marc Discovering Stuff and Game-Changer
[01:29:54] Closing the Podcast
[01:31:49] End of Podcast
Ben: On this episode of the Ben Greenfield Fitness podcast.
Marc: So, what you want to do is you want to grow them beforehand before you consume them so you're actually consuming a live organism rather than taking a dead organism and hope it turns into life in your body. It basically creates a harmonic bubble. So, it harmonizes all the frequencies that come into that bubble.
Ben: So, you're basically using quantum physics to slow downtime in the cell.
Health, performance, nutrition, longevity, ancestral living, biohacking, and much more. My name is Ben Greenfield. Welcome to the show.
Well, today's show is going to be an interesting one. Someone randomly reached out to me, wanted to remain completely anonymous, proceeded to absolutely blow my mind with some of the things that they were emailing me about as far as emerging biohacking technologies that I was surprised I'd never heard of as a guy who's kind of immersed in this whole world. So, I thought, “Well, what the heck?” I'm okay with keeping them anonymous if they'll agree to come on my show and talk about this stuff because, occasionally, I'll get somebody on. It might not be some triple board-certified physician but who, instead, is just kind of bit immersed in this stuff and knows a lot about it.
So, prepare to dive down some deep dark rabbit holes of biohacking on today's show. Strap on your scientific tinfoil hats because this one's going to get crazy.
Speaking of getting crazy, my book launch parties are coming up in New York City and in LA. So, if you're near there or you want to travel to New York City or LA during the month of January, you're going to love it. Awesome food, amazing drinks, wonderful people. And it's all going to be going down on January the 16th in New York City at a place called The Assemblage. And then, in LA, there's three more parties planned: one on the 29th, one on the 30th, one on 31st. So, you can get all the details, you can RSVP, you can know exactly where to show up and when, come to one of the parties, come to all of them, if you go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com/calendar. That's BenGreenfieldFitness.com/calendar, to get in on the “Boundless” book launch parties.
And if you want the book, which would probably be a good idea, go to boundlessbook.com to get your hands on my new book. And I got my own copy the other day, my pre-release copy. And I was reading it and I turned to my wife and I'm like, “Damn, this is actually a book that I would read.” Meaning, I wrote a book that I really, really would cherish and love. And I think you guys are going to love it too. So, there you have it. I'll jump off my narcissistic soapbox now.
We have a fasting challenge going on right now as well over at Kion. It's a Free Five-Day Fasting Challenge. It starts Monday, which is soon, if you've been listening to this podcast when it comes out January 6th. So, this is your last chance to get your hands on our “Fasting Decoded” book. There's a chance to ask me all your burning questions about fasting and get them answered. We've got tens of thousands of people signed up for this fast. You get to choose your adventure: intermittent fasting, fasting-mimicking diet, 24-hour fast, water fast. We walk you through the whole thing. We support you along the way. Wonderful way to start off the new year and to quit shoving cookies down your gaping maw. So, you don't want to miss the fasting challenge you get in for free right now if you go to getkion.com/fasting. That's getk-i-o-n.com/fasting.
This podcast is also brought to you by my favorite probiotic on the face of the planet, super unique probiotic, way different than any others out there. Not only does it have 24 strains of beneficial bacteria but they've added three different prebiotic compounds in there, including pomegranate seed extract which, as I write about my new book, produces Urolithin A in your gut which is actually an anti-aging and longevity compound. They capsulate it in an algae medium that means it gets through the acidic nature of your stomach. And they're doing some really, really cool research at this company to get probiotics even as far down as your colon which most probiotics don't make it anywhere near. So, if you have issues down lower, like constipation or irritable bowel that you feel is related to colon, you don't have to do a probiotic enema anymore. You can just swallow this stuff and it makes it all the way to your colon. They've actually tested this. They used a test called the Shine test which models the harshest conditions in the GI tract. And their daily probiotic delivered a maximum release of probiotics all the way through to the end of the small intestine and into the colon. So, there you have it. Most probiotics don't even survive the trip into the gut. This one does. I've had them on my podcast before. You go listen to my podcast with them. It's called Seed. And you get a discount, a 15% discount on Seed. You go to seed.com. Very easy to remember: seed.com/Ben. s-e-e-d.com/Ben. And your code is BEN15. This is the exact probiotic I use every day. Swear by it. So, seed.com/Ben and use code, BEN15.
Oh, hey. And one last thing. Even though this is really fascinating discussion with this guy, A, I had to record in a coffee shop because it was a holiday and I don't have internet in my house right now and I had to drive around town finding a place to have this chat. So, forgive me about the background noise. Just imagine I'm in a coffee shop.
And then, the other thing is towards the end my audio got a little scratchy. I didn't know it was getting scratchy until I heard the finished product. And so, bear with me towards the end. I apologized that I'm not NPR. But, it's good information nonetheless. So, enjoy.
Hey, folks. It's Ben Greenfield. As promised, I have a super-secret mystery guest on the show with me. And if it sounds like we're actually chatting at a coffee shop, it's because half of us are. I'm actually at a coffee shop right now, recording this particular episode for you on January 1st. I actually haven't had internet at my own house for about two weeks now and I've been slipping away to the local library to record episodes for you. But, of course, today, being January 1st, the library's closed. And so, you guys are getting probably a little bit of Starbucks holiday music in the background; maybe, some espresso grinders. So, just imagine that you're hanging out of the coffee shop with me and with my guest who have given me the option to not actually give his name, if he'd like to remain anonymous. But, as you learned in the introduction to this show, he emailed me some really interesting biohacks and some kind of advanced health and technology tools that I was surprisingly unfamiliar with, considering how immersed I consider myself to be with a lot of this stuff.
So, I thought, “Well, I should get this dude on the show. We should chat about some of this stuff for you, guys.” So, that being said, I should ask my guest, do you want me to use your name, man? Or, do you want me to just kind of refer to you as the dude?
Marc: Just stick with Marc and we're good.
Ben: All right. Well, will just call you Marc, which is your actual name, right? Marc.
Marc: That is. Correct, yeah.
Ben: Okay, cool. For those of you listening in, this is literally the first time Marc and I have chatted, aside from going back and forth quite a bit on email, planning on having a little chat about this stuff. So, here we go into our coffee shop style chat.
So, Marc, lay down your background for me and how you kind of got interested in all this stuff in the first place.
Marc: Well, my background is actually banking. So, I started out in finance, project finance, do a lot of renewable energy stuff–from solar power, wind power. And then, went into due diligence processes for these investments. And I kind of developed an eye for what's wrong with certain investments. Okay, so, I've read into solar power, wind power. And the economics are they look good on paper, they look good financially. But, on a global impact perspective, if you just don't look at it from a macroeconomic standpoint, it's not probably that viable compared to other technologies out there. It just sounds good.
So, I confronted some of my business partners, investors, with it and I was like, “Look, are we in here to make money?”, which is fine. From a money perspective, it all works out. But, we're looking for socioeconomic impact here. Because this is really not the best option of doing and not the best way to apply your money to get the highest form of leverage. And from then on, they listened to me and they were like, “Okay, well, let me hear your case.” They heard my case. They understood pretty much. I was there like, “Okay. Well, this is more than we expected. So, we're just going to drop that.” And from there on, I was pretty much passed around because of my analytical background to do all kinds of very alternative investment analysis.
Ben: Primarily doing due diligence on these companies?
Marc: No, not necessarily companies but general undertakings, all right?
Marc: So, I'm not talking about a specific solar company or a specific wind company. I'm talking about the big spectrum of it.
And then, later down the line, I developed something that I call applied [00:10:08] ______ of strategies, which basically means I just look at every aspect of certain things and try to incorporate the global view on it. I don't isolate my view on anything that I do. Or, when I do research, I cannot isolate it into specific sectors.
And then, in my early 20s, I started a hedge fund that went pretty well and got a minor kidney disease as well which is supposedly incurable, which kept me really, really interested in longevity, putting my head into it. Obviously, talking to a lot of people with a decent amount of stash, cash. I got passed around and got to know very, very, very, very interesting scientists, research and development people, and then, analyze those and made–I don't want to say decisions, necessarily–but figure out if it's worthwhile investing into those situations. And, yeah, that's how it all came about. All from the money angle.
Ben: Where were you from, originally? That's not an English accent.
Marc: No. Originally, I'm from Europe. So, German.
Marc: And I've just been bouncing around the globe ever since.
Ben: Got it. And tell me about this kidney issue that led you to get a little bit more just in the health aspects of some of these companies?
Marc: It's called PKD, polycystic kidney disease which, basically, it's a protein defect on the PK-1 protein. It's like broken. And what it does, it basically creates massive cysts on my kidneys that are filling with blood. If there's too much tension on the body, they burst and cause renal failure.
Ben: Wow. And is this something that's actually controllable? Or, have you been able to find out ways that allopathic medicine might not use to take care of?
Marc: Standard medicine just says, “You're screwed.” It's an incurable hereditary disease. There's nothing you can do about it. You can manage it by decreasing your blood pressure, all the standard stuff. I found a few scientists in Australia that put me on a ketogenic diet. So, that's how that one started–with the ketogenic diet. Because it turns out that if you dial down your glucose, the cysts don't grow as quick. So, they need glucose to grow. So, you cut that out. So, that's pretty good. And then, there is a protein that's called klotho protein. I don't know if you've heard of that.
Ben: Oh, yeah, absolutely.
Marc: So, klotho, basically, also helps with that disease. So, if you can increase klotho production, then, you're pretty much cool.
Ben: Yeah, klotho protein is actually very interesting. I think it was discovered sometime around the '90s and it's named after the Greek goddess, Klotho. But, apparently, it has some pretty major effects on longevity and anti-aging, even with exogenous administration of that protein. But, I actually haven't researched that much on whether or not klotho is available.
Marc: You cannot inject it. It's impossible. It's too complex of the protein.
Ben: So, the injections that they've done with that, was that rodent model?
Marc: I don't know if they did it in rodent models. What I know is one of my guys is super advanced in this research field. And he says the protein is way too complex. And, especially, if you inject it, it doesn't really work. And if you drink it or take it as a supplement, your stomach acid just tears it up, so you don't really have the effect. You might get it into your body but you're never going to activate it. So, you have to look for precursors to activate klotho production.
Ben: What would be some of the precursors?
Marc: Well, it's actually probiotics, because klotho is produced. When they found klotho, there's this weird rat. I'm not sure, it's like a naked rat. I forgot the name of it. There's like a naked rat in the desert.
Ben: I think you're talking about the naked mole-rat, probably.
Ben: The one with the really robust. It's got really robust DNA protection mechanisms because of its ability to repair misfolded proteins.
Marc: Yeah. And compared to normal rats, it just lives like a thousand years or something like that, if you compare it from human age perspective to animal perspective. And they found out that the only difference in that rodent model and us is actually some probiotics, their gut biome. So, just the gut biome. So, if you change the gut biome, let's say, in a correct way, whatever that correct way is– Don't ask me because that's just too advanced for me. I can put you in contact with the guys that are doing it. They have found that when you consume a certain mixture of probiotics which have been, there's a chlorine sulfate in it which basically enhances the gravitational field inside of the cells to basically create time dilation, which basically allows your DNA intercells to have more relative time than the normal 24-hour time span. Because you're creating an internal gravitational field, gravitational field increases. Time is, from the perspective standpoint of that cell, is reduced. So, you basically get 40 hours of work down into a 24-hour legitimate time cycle. Does that make sense?
Ben: Can you explain that in a little bit more detail, what you mean regarding the time cycles because that didn't quite make sense to me?
Marc: Okay. So, you have 24 hours in a day.
Marc: So, your body works on 24-hour time cycle, right? It just works on a 24-hour basis. When you induce higher gravitational field inside of atoms and when you actually target the atoms that are inside of your DNA, from the perspective of your DNA, it actually looks like that your DNA has now 40 hours of time rather than just the 24 hours that you see.
Marc: You change the perspective. From your perspective, you're still doing 24 hours, right?
Marc: You're still doing that. But, from the perspective of your cell, because it hasn't increased a gravitational field inside and the electrons basically spin around it faster, they get like 40 hours of work done. There's a movie called “Interstellar” where they were flying into the black hole, gravitational field increases, they are on some planet for like 10 minutes or something like that, but on planet earth, it's like 20 years passed by because they are in a stronger gravitational field.
So, that's actually scientifically proven that you can induce time dilation. It's an Einstein saying time dilation in cells. So, basically give them, from their perspective they have lived two days, they have two days to repair themselves rather than, from our perspective, only the one day.
Ben: Okay, got it. And what does that have to do with this actual ability to be able to support the microbiome to produce its own klotho proteins?
Marc: Because the way I understand it is that when you get a certain microbes in your gut and induce those with, there's a sulfate that comes with it, that increases the time dilation in the cells. So, [00:17:50] ______ the gut microbiome has more time to fix your DNA damage. And the particular field where they're attacking is the klotho production. So, it actually allows you to produce more klotho in a 24-hour window than you would normally do. Because, from the perspective of that klotho protein, [00:18:12] ______ happening, actually, two days have passed. Does that make sense?
Marc: So, you eat the microbiome, the gut stuff, it starts the process. And then, you induce time dilation so you get a factor of two out of the same amount of time.
Ben: And how is the time dilation actually induced upon consumption of this probiotic?
Marc: Because in the probiotic there is–I mean, I can look it up if you want me to. Just hang on. There is a sulfate that comes with it. And with that sulfate, it increases the gravitational field of that particular cell that the probiotics are targeting.
Ben: Okay. So, in a nutshell, you're using quantum physics that are induced by the sulfate that's attached to this probiotic to slow downtime in the cell and, at the same time, increase production of the klotho proteins. You're essentially, I would imagine, affecting methylation to slow down the aging clock and then also getting an increase in klotho protein production.
Marc: Basically, what it comes down to is you did two times the amount of klotho production in a 24-hour cycle because your body lives 48 hours.
Ben: Okay. So, one thing I was able to find because you had sent me over some information on this probiotic, Dr. Marco Ruggiero has a video called “The Theory of Relativity Help Us to Solve Aging.” And I believe he presented this at RAADfest which is a really good anti-aging conference. And so, I'll link to that in the shownotes.
By the way, folks, the shownotes for today's podcasts are going to be at BenGreenfieldFitness.com/marc. That's just BenGreenfieldFitness.com/m-a-r-c. So, you're going to be famous now, Marc. At least, your first name is.
And one of the problems I ran into, though, when I was researching this same probiotic that Dr. Ruggiero seems to promote–
Marc: Which one are we talking about?
Marc: That's one of it. Correct, yeah.
Ben: Okay. It was difficult to find out the actual strain being used, the actual probiotic strain. I mean, it makes sense that they would have this sulfate molecule that is delivered along with it, but I could not find any research on the actual strain. It all seemed to be protected on their website.
Marc: There's just a little–Hold on. Let me just go into the portal here. The reason why I didn't name him before is because I don't want to do name dropping on the stuff because I don't want anyone to think that I'm pitching anything. But, if you will allow me to drop names, then, I'll be more than happy to come out with these.
Ben: Yeah, that's fine. I mean, I know this isn't a pitch fest as much. It's just an interesting discussion about some of these things I was unfamiliar with.
Marc: Okay. I have to find it. I'll send you the strains over. I definitely have them.
Ben: Okay, yeah. If you find them, what I'll do is I'll put them in the shownotes. And so, this would be a probiotic that you would take on a daily basis to increase klotho protein which can decelerate aging. Have you actually been using this for your kidney issue as well?
Marc: Yeah. To an extent, I've used something called Bravo and the GcMAF.
Marc: And the klotho. They only started production; I think it's like a year old. It's a year old, so they're really, really, really selective of what's being sold, and all that stuff. So, I personally have not used it. I just know a lot of people that have used it.
Ben: You mean, this immortalis probiotic?
Marc: This immortalis, yeah.
Marc: Because it's priced at $2,500 a month.
Ben: Oh, wow, geez.
Marc: Yeah, it's a really, really, really big price tag.
Marc: [00:21:46] ______ process. Because you cannot take the pill like this. You have to make your own. But, you take the pill, you break it open. And it's like a three-day process to actually make.
Ben: Olive oil.
Marc: [00:21:56] ______ olive oil. You can't just pop the pill because you need to activate the probiotics so that they multiply by a factor of, I don't know how many times. So, you have to grow them and then consume them three to four days later after you've grown them.
Ben: Oh, wow. That's incredibly interesting. And it sounds like C60 to a certain extent, that buckminsterfullerene molecule I've done a podcast on, which has some pretty good anti-aging data in rodent models. And that one also needs to be delivered in like an olive oil or even like a CA oil mechanism.
Marc: I know about the C60 stuff. But, with this one, the reason why you have to put it in olive oil or why you have to put it in yogurt is to actually activate the bacteria because the bacteria in the pill, they only activate once they're in contact with you when you swallow them. And then, they start growing. So, what you want to do is you want to grow them beforehand before you consume them so you're actually consuming a live organism, rather than taking a dead organism and hope it turns into life in your body.
Ben: Right, yeah. That makes sense. For people who may not have $2,500 a month to throw out a probiotic, there are, and I looked into this a little bit, some other ways to activate klotho. There's a little bit of research behind.
So, first of all, to shut it down, like to suppress klotho, psychological stress and depression. That's big for decreasing klotho protein production. Inflammation and oxidative stress. Interestingly, all three things that we see heavily associated with chronic disease also decrease klotho protein production. So, psychological stress and depression, inflammation, and oxidative stress.
And then, another one that would decrease it would be angiotensin, which is, basically, an enzyme that appears to be in excess amounts. Actually, it has the ability to be able to decrease klotho protein.
But then, there are things that increase it pretty significantly. Vitamin D seems to increase it pretty significantly. Insulin, meaning that that could be one downside to long-term protein restriction. Or, a very low carbohydrate diet would might down regulate this klotho protein, which is why I think most of the good anti-aging protocols these days are like press pulse cycling between periods of anabolism and periods of catabolism.
Exercise is one of the top ways to increase it. Specifically, the resistance trainings. It seems that muscle injury and the formation of new muscle cells, as the muscle cells are made, it increases secretion of klotho protein while the muscles are being repaired.
And then, a few other things that were interesting. One was cordyceps. Another one was ginseng root extract. And then, finally, activated charcoal can actually bind to a specific toxin that you can get from some dietary factors called indoxyl sulfate, which you'd find in a lot of ultra-process and heavily processed foods. And so, if you take activated charcoal that also appears to have an impact on your ability to be able to produce klotho.
So, a lot of these things, being cognizant of cycling your insulin levels, making sure your vitamin D status is good, exercising, binding toxins with activated charcoal, and, maybe, working in some supplements like cordyceps or ginseng root, might actually be able to increase klotho naturally.
Marc: Yeah. But, with the vitamin D, which I totally agree with you on that one, the problem is when you take vitamin D–have you heard of the vitamin D transport protein?
Ben: You're not talking about calcitriol, are you?
Marc: I'm not sure if that's the medical term [00:25:37] ______. But, it's vitamin D transport system. Protein, sorry. That is actually responsible for channeling your vitamin D to certain cells and, also, to run your fatty acids toward where it needs to be. But, most importantly, what it also does is it activates your immune system. So, when your bone marrow releases macrophages killer cells. And there's another cell. I forgot the name of it. It's all activated by the vitamin D transport system.
The thing is if you have too many toxins in your body, like viruses, cancer, pathogens, they produce an enzyme called nagalase. Have you heard of that, nagalase? It's an enzyme that basically chops off the sugars on the vitamin D transport protein. Okay, so you have to reduce your nagalase enzymes in your body in order for the vitamin D to actually have a full effect.
Marc: So, that's very, very important to know that you can enhance it if you reduce nagalase.
Ben: And is there a method to decrease that enzyme?
Marc: Yeah. You basically chop off because three sugars are on the protein and all three sugars are responsible.
There's a Japanese guy called Dr. Yamamoto who found that out in mid-'90s or something like that. That when you chop two of those sugars away, then, the nagalase has no effect. So, you have to artificially chop these sugars away, which is basically the same thing that, again, is with the sulfate. You have to induce that sulfate. They use it in Japan. They use it in other people's blood to do that, but you can also induce that with a specific sulfate to chop these sugars away. Then, it doesn't allow you to produce killer cells for a little bit. But, what it does allow you is that the nagalase cannot activate it and you produce more macrophages.
Marc: And then, if you produce more macrophages, you enhance your immune system. Your immune system has, then, a way to basically, A, number one, it starts killing cancer cells, viruses, etc. And then, once your immune system is stable, you stop taking this stuff to basically activate the other two cells, the killer cells. And then, you can also absorb more vitamin D in this whole process.
Ben: So, nagalase would actually suppress the immune system by suppressing some of your immune cells like macrophages. But, nagalase or high nagalase levels.
Marc: Macrophages are not active if you have nagalase in your blood. Macrophages are your bone marrow still sends out the cells into the blood, okay? They send the white blood cells out. So, if you do your normal blood tests, you still have high blood cell counts, white blood cell counts. Everything looks fine on paper. But, the problem is that these cells are dormant. They're not activated if you have nagalase in it, because they need those sugar proteins that the nagalase needs.
Ben: Right. So, you would actually want to decrease the levels of the nagalase enzyme in order to naturally increase vitamin D levels and, at the same time, increase or put yourself into a situation where you could have higher levels of klotho protein? But, the question would be, how would you actually decrease production of nagalase enzymes?
Marc: Well, there's a process called GcMAF or something like that, glycol-something, something. It's a specific process developed in Japan. You take donor blood injected. It's really, really questionable now. At least, in modern science, takes it that way. Or, you can buy a product for it. It's also Dr. Ruggiero. That's how I know about that. It has a product out that does exactly that thing. It only targets that specific vitamin D transport protein to make sure that nagalase dies off.
Ben: We talked about that same probiotic that you're mentioning earlier.
Marc: No, it's a different one.
Marc: This is the probiotic that's only there for klotho production. And then, there's another thing. It's called immuno which also has a sulfate in it, but it's structured a little bit differently and that only attacks the vitamin D transport protein.
Ben: Okay, got it. And if you have information on that particular product, go ahead and send it over to me. And I'll include it in the shownotes. But, yeah, that GcMAF. That's macrophage-activating factor that would be the one that nagalase would break down.
Marc: Correct. Well, it will stop nagalase to–Sorry, I don't have to say that. When you take that stuff, the GcMAF, when you take that, the nagalase just runs around in your cell and doesn't know what to do, because the GcMAF, it breaks down two of the three sugars. And if two of the sugars are missing, nagalase doesn't know what to do. It just like flies around and doesn't know what to do. It doesn't have a job at that moment.
Ben: Do you know what the two biggest sources of nagalase are in many, many people's environments?
Marc: Cancer, viruses, pathogens.
Ben: Well, yeah. The high nagalase would be present in those conditions, but the two things that would actually directly elevate nagalase levels that even if you don't have cancer or anything like that is high alcohol consumption and vaccines. So, if you're living a traditional western lifestyle, getting vaccinated and also drinking a lot of alcohol, your nagalase levels are naturally elevated, which would be, of course, directly inhibited of the longevity and anti-aging support that the klotho protein would bestow. So, it's interesting to think about that there are things that just about everybody is doing, drinking alcohol and getting vaccinated, that would actually affect that. And I don't know if we need to open the vaccine can of worms. But, it is interesting that it will massively increase your nagalase levels.
Marc: Well, it makes sense that some people are weird about vaccines if that's the case. I did not know that. It's no information to me. But, interesting thing. I definitely have to look into that.
Ben: Now, speaking of the gut biome, I believe there is one other thing that you emailed me about related to the gut biome DNA. And I think it actually had to do, in this case, kind of a little bit of a different direction. I believe it had to do with 5G to a certain extent and the effect of 5G on the biome, or something like that. Am I correct in remembering that?
Marc: Yeah. There is a lot of people that are afraid of RF and microwaves and all the stuffs out there, including 5G, LTE, Wi-Fi, the negative effects of that. And there's a lot of, let's say, aka studies that have been done where people are proving it has a negative effect. Other people say it doesn't have a negative effect. What actually turns out, which I thought was kind of interesting when I talk to a friend of mine that is really involved in this 5G stuff, is that they found out in their studies that the RF or EMF, or whatever you want to call it, it doesn't actually attack the human DNA. It actually attacks the gut microbiome and changes the DNA of the gut microbiome, and even the microbiome of the brain. So, everything else that's not human, that's affected because, as far as I understand, they don't really have a good shield to protect themselves from it.
And from that perspective on, once the gut microbiome changes in their DNA, that has an effect on the whole body. And that's where, supposedly, the negative effects of radio waves come from. It doesn't actually have an effect on the human body directly, no. It is actually more the gut microbiome and the brain-gut biome, or whatever you called it. It has an effect on that. And that modulates the DNA differently.
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Yeah. Was that the study that came out last year? I think it was on mobile phones. And I saw it somewhere, but it was basically talking about mobile phone use and the potential effect on human bacteria that were exposed to non-native EMF fields. I think, they looked at non-ionizing and ionizing radiation. And they found that specific strains of E. coli became dominant and overgrown in direct response to exposure to mobile devices or Wi-Fi. And I don't know if this was in vitro or in vivo, but there was a little bit of a clue there.
And, again, this would this would be interesting because Dr. Mercola, in his new book, EMF, makes a case for certain supplements to help reduce the effects of this radiation on human cells; particularly, the intake of NAD to help to repair some of the cell damage, the DNA damage, that occurs. And then, intake of magnesium to combat some of the calcium influx that occurs into the cell in response to this radiation. And then, the final one, if I recall it, I think it was ketones to increase the nerve pathways, which seem to be downregulated. These inflammation-reducing pathways or inflammation-modulating pathways, those can get downregulated in response to non-native EMF. And, therefore, nutritional ketosis or the use of ketone esters can help to up-regulate those pathways. But, from what you're saying, you could make a case that, especially, as it relates to 5G, the consumption of some type of probiotic or higher intake of fermented foods may also offer some kind of protective effects in that case.
Marc: What is known is that, definitely, the immortalis probiotic strains can withstand the 5G.
Ben: Okay. And you keep coming back to that. And I should clarify, you're not financially associated with that company at all?
Marc: No, nothing.
Ben: Okay. All right.
Marc: I know the owner. That's it. I have no financial affiliation with it. Nothing, I don't make a buck.
Ben: Okay. So, based on this, there was something you emailed me about. I've talked before about some of these products that I haven't seen a lot of research behind, just anecdotal evidence that may provide some protection against 5G or non-native EMF. I've talked about the BluShield device before. I've talked about the Somavedic device. Some people use these so-called harmonizing devices. And again, admittedly, I'm not convinced there's a good deal of human clinical research on the effects of these things. Although, a lot of people with electro hypersensitivity will swear by how they feel afterwards. And I've had clients do a pre and post-inflammatory tests and seen a distinct drop in their CRP levels, even without changing anything else.
And I use these devices in my home and feel that I sleep better. And I just feel better during the day of work when I have these plugged in my office. But, you had a device that you emailed me about that I hadn't heard of before, that I think was related to this discussion on the biome.
Marc: I don't think [00:39:56] ______ heard about it. It was released in September or something like that.
Ben: Okay. So, tell me about this one.
Marc: Well, I mean, this goes all the way down to quantum physics, okay? I know a little bit about quantum physics but don't even test me on this. The only thing that I know from this device–again, I know the scientist. I know the owner of the company. No financial affiliation, just putting this out there straight–this actually comes from a Russian research lab, some really, very, very weird guys. Let me put it this way. Someone I can't have a conversation with because they're way above my head.
So, what this little device does, it changes the frequency field around you in an eight-meter diameter around you. It basically creates a harmonic bubble. So, it harmonizes all the frequencies that come into that bubble. So, it's not like you're blocked off, like in a Faraday cage. It's not like that. But, what it does is the negative effects on the human body are cycled out. Because it's the same thing, frequencies or waves. If you count a wave, if you send counter waves to it, you basically block out the signal, right? You've probably seen this with radio jammers. So, if you find the right frequency, send the same frequency back, it cancels it out. So, there's no effect on it. And it's basically what that device does.
Ben: That's exactly how the folks at BluShield described how their device works. So, I'm wondering if it's the same technology as what BlueShield is using.
Marc: I don't know. I really don't know because I've never heard of BluShield. The only thing I know is that that device, the studies that have been done on it in very, very small groups are literally insane. Heart rate variability dropped after two minutes of using it.
Ben: I went to their website and looked at some of the research. I mean, admittedly, pretty small population studies. And it's still unclear to me, not being a quantum physicist, exactly the mechanism of action to how these are providing protection. But, again, I look at a lot of things based on, even if the effects can't be explained, what's happening on a biological systems level. And I went to their website and I did look over some of their heart rate variability data. And it actually is pretty significant, the increase in HRV in response to non-ionizing radiation in the presence of one of these. And I haven't personally used one and haven't ordered one. I kind of want to talk with you a little bit about it before. I would try it out myself. But, I know some of this stuff. It gets a lot of everything from HRV analysis to, I think, they did dark field analysis of the blood. I know a lot of folks in science will raise an eyebrow at that. But, it's definitely doing something. That's kind of my take on a lot of these so-called harmonizing devices or protective bubble or frequency devices. It's difficult to explain, but they seem to be doing something.
Marc: Well, with the 5G shield, the one thing that sold me on this whole thing was having it in a car and getting 30% more range on a car. Don't ask me how that worked.
Ben: Wait, 30% more what?
Marc: Range, in a freaking gasoline car. Don't know how, don't know why, but it makes my car run faster than I'm assuming. I can run faster.
Ben: Now, these things are USB's. They come in a USB stick, so you're just putting it in the USB port of your car?
Marc: No, you just carry it with you. The USB thing that is on there, the reason why it has USB is if you plug it into electricity, it increases the range of the whole thing. So, it increases the range. But, it has an idle energy that's enough to basically create an eight-diameter bubble around you. And, it affects most organisms. I mean, plant studies have been done where plants just grow faster. And that, for me, if a plant grows faster and if my car goes longer, it's not going to harm me.
Ben: Well, make an introduction to me to the folks who run that, if you have any contacts, because I would love to, perhaps, interview them a little bit more detail about it and get some more details myself or test one out and see what I notice. But, I find it interesting.
There are other things that you emailed me about, too, as well. I know we're kind of jumping around, but I definitely wanted to ask you about the very first thing that you reached out to me asking me about or informing me that you had some really good information about. And that's this idea of V-cells. So, a year and a half ago, I was in New York City and I visited the offices of Dr. Halland Chen. He withdrew about a pint of my blood.
Marc: How much is that in liters? It's quite a bit, right?
Ben: What is that? No, I think it's like–pint liter conversion, geez. I don't know what it comes out to. I guess one liter is what, two pints?
Marc: Yeah, it's half a liter.
Ben: Yes, half a liter. And then, he stressed it overnight in a very cold medium to increase production of these so-called very small embryonic stem cells, gave me a bunch of NAD and CoQ10 that night. And then, the next morning, re-injected the isolated V-cells, along with exosomes to increase their signaling effect. And I felt amazing for like three months afterwards. And there is definitely something going on with this use of these so-called V-cells. But then, you emailed me and told me that you had discovered some other things about these so-called V-cells, which are truly pluripotent. They can turn into any stem cell needed by the body.
Marc: They're actually totipotent. They're not pluripotent. The ones that I'm talking about, they're totipotent.
Ben: Okay. And explain to the listeners the difference between totipotency in the pluripotency.
Marc: Well, you have totipotency which, basically, is the cell that can be any cell. Then, you have pluripotency which like the MSE stem cells, EPS stem cells, that can be a big variety of different cells. Then, you have multipotency cells which when the variety shrinks down, they can be four or five cells. And then, you have singular potency. So, the stem cell that can only be one particular cell. So, totipotent is basically the holy grail of stem cells.
Ben: Okay, got it. So, these things are totipotent. And what is it that you found out about on your end regarding these very small embryonic-like stem cells?
Marc: So, there is a friend of mine, used to work for the government and has done research in the mid-90's on this stuff. And what we found out with the very small embryonic stem cells that I send you over, I'm not 100% certain those are the same cells we're talking about, because there's an overlaying worry for it. They found that in the blood there are very, very small stem cells that are non-activated. They are basically just floating around in the body and the body just does not know what to do with them. The body doesn't attack them and the body doesn't use them. They're just dormant and they're constantly being produced. So, when you stress these cells, what actually happens is, I always use the skittle analogy.
Let's assume those cells have a little skittle layer around it. What you do when you stress them, you break that skittle layer open and allow the cells to be detected by your body. And then, your body just decides where these cells goes and starts replacing them. So, that's the really, really, really interesting part about it. And they can be literally any cell you want it to be. So, it's like you tell the cell, “Hey, I want you to be a hard cell.” That's not what you can do. You cannot the cell. The body decides what it does first, unless you do a specific procedure where you induce the frequency into the cells, so they have a vibrational frequency, which doesn't matter which frequency it is. And then, you point a specific device which is also a frequency device to the organ where you want the cells to go to. So, it's like, in turn, a little magnet.
Ben: Okay. So, I'm going to back up just a second. So, these VSC's, they are produced by the body normally. And the idea is that even though they're constantly produced, like billions and billions of these things every single day, they're not used as effectively as they could be, because the outer layer of those cells needs to be broken to allow them to become truly pluripotent and to do things like help to repair DNA or tissue, etc.
Now, what you're saying is that there are devices that can be used, rather than getting your own blood drawn out and inject it, you can use a device to actually increase the bioavailability or the activity of these VSC's using a device.
Marc: Well, the device, there's a device that's being planned to do that. Right now, you still have to take blood out and then put it in the device, activate it, and then, re-inject it. It takes about five to ten minutes. It's really not that big of a deal. It depends on your specific cells. Some cells need to stay or some people's blood needs to stay in the device five minutes and 30 seconds. Others, six minutes and 20 seconds. It has to be fine-tuned because everybody is different.
Ben: Got it. What is the device and how is it actually working?
Marc: It's a high-frequency pulse laser. So, basically, that's what it is. And depending on how long you leave it in there, you either destroy the cell or you don't open it up. So, it's a fine-tuning mechanism for every person. So, it's very, very difficult to just say, “Look, I'm going to put your blood in there and off we go,” because we would have to test the blood over and over again until we find that, let's say, the correct protocol, the correct external protocol to open up the cells.
Ben: Sounds so much similar to UV radiation blood protocols or photon-based blood protocols where they'll use lasers or ultraviolet or radiation in some medical clinics. I know Dr. Matt Cook who I've interviewed on the podcast before. He does this at his clinic. I believe Ahvie Herskowitz who I have also interviewed, a San Francisco practitioner, does this in his clinic. But, this sounds slightly different in that they're using some kind of different laser frequency to actually activate these cells using photonic energy.
Marc: Yes, correct. Yeah, that's what it is. It's kind of like, think about when someone screams into a glass, if you hit the right frequency, it explodes.
Ben: What's the name of the device or the protocol? Do you know?
Marc: No. I mean, it's not even commercially available.
Ben: Well, I mean, is there a website that describes the protocol, or anything like that?
Ben: Really? How did you find out about it?
Marc: A friend of mine works there.
Ben: Works where?
Marc: For those people that are doing it. They're researching it. A friend of mine basically was involved in the development of the laser. And then, the medical application that is now overseeing the laser development in the medical application for that. But, it's not commercially available.
Ben: Is this specific clinic or hospital?
Marc: It's a research lab. Let me put it this way. I don't want to go into much detail about it, if it's okay with you.
Ben: Okay. Yeah, I understand. It's a little bit murky to me. But, this sounds like one of those fields to keep our eyes on. I couldn't find any information about it.
Marc: Keep your eyes open. I'm sure it's going to see the day of light. I mean, there's definitely interest to make it see the day of light. The problem is it's just not commercially viable right now because the findings [00:52:05] _______ so darn expensive.
Ben: You say day of light. We say light of day in the US.
Marc: Sorry. Yeah, light of day.
Ben: Have you ever seen the guy on YouTube? I don't this would be offensive to you, but he's a German guy named Flula Borg. And he tears into popular American euphemisms like party pooper or the another one that he does. I'm blanking. But, anyways, he literally interprets American euphemisms. Or, the early bird gets the worm. You should look him up on YouTube. He's hilarious.
Marc: I will.
Ben: His name is Flula Borg, comedian. Okay. So, this V-cell thing sounds like just something to keep an eye on. It does make me wonder too.
Marc: The one cool part about it that I want to tell you is you take 30 milliliters. I don't know what that is in American. And you take 30 milliliters and you get about two and a half billion stem cells.
Ben: Wow, two and a half billion, you said?
Marc: Two and a half billion.
Ben: Holy cow.
Marc: So, you have 100 [00:53:03] ______ cells in your body with the rough approximation. So, there is a lot. And the fun part about these cells is, I think I've heard you talk about MSC's before, that you were doing MSC's.
Marc: Those cells only multiply like 200 times.
Ben: Yeah. Well, even if you enzymatically grow them, which isn't even legal right now, to my knowledge, in the U.S. You have to go overseas to get a culturally explanted MSC concentration from your own fat, for example. But, even then, it's nowhere near two and a half billion.
Marc: No. It's nothing because those cells are so darn small. They're just, I don't know how many microbes. They're really, really darn small. And you're going to actually multiply them. So, it's not like you're growing them in the culture. But, the MSC's, you grow them in the culture. Well, you would grow them in the culture if it were legal. You grow them in a culture, let's say, to get more out of them. But then, they actually lose potency as well. So, by the time you inject them, they don't really have the same potency by the time you took them out of your body. Does that make sense?
Ben: Right. Yeah, which is why co-administration with exosomes is such a good idea if you're getting stem cells. It increases the cell signaling effect of the stem cells because, by themselves, they're less potent and unless they're accompanied by a cell-signaling molecule, like exosomes, which is why a lot of good practitioners will co-administer something like MSC's and exosomes. But, this protocol is really interesting. I'm going to see if I can do some research and find a little bit more out about it.
And by the way, one quick thing that just came to my mind before we go on. I told you, guys, who are listening in that the shownotes were going to be at BenGreenfieldFitness.com/marc. But, I did just realize I think that links to an EMS machine that I promoted in the past, called the MarcPro. So, I'm going to change the link for you guys. This is going to be BenGreenfieldFitness.com/newbiohacks. BenGreenfieldFitness.com/newbiohacks. So, don't go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com/Marc. Go to BenGreenfieldFitness.com/newbiohacks. And like Marc, my guest, I don't have a financial affiliation with any of these companies. Actually, this is an interesting discussion. So, it's not going to be a bunch of affiliate links and stuff like that, but is just links to some of the research studies and things that we're talking about.
It does make me think, though, about this new science of photobiomodulation and a lot of the research you can find by Dr. Michael Hamblin on PubMed, the use of these infrared light panels like the Joovv or red light saunas, or using sunlight as a health strategy. I would suspect that there's some amount of photonic energy derived from those strategies that may actually have some kind of a similar assistive effect on stem cell mobilization or proliferation. And I'm actually reading a really interesting book. You'd probably like this one, Marc. It's called “The Human Photosynthesis.” And it delves into the human's ability to essentially engage in photosynthesis very similar to a plant. Rather than using chlorophyll molecule, we use the melanin molecule. And when the melanin molecule is split with photon-based energy from, say, sunlight, you actually get this very interesting up-regulation mitochondrial activity release of ATP, etc. So, full circle. Even if someone can't afford this laser photon treatment of their withdrawn blood, it still makes a case, in my opinion. Especially, while I'm reading this book, “Human Photosynthesis,” to really use sunlight and other forms of photobiomodulation as a life-extending strategy and as an overall health strategy. I think, really, it's as important as food and a movement protocol is exposure to light.
Marc: Well, if you want to mobilize small stem cells, there's actually, let me just find it, I'm going to tell you in one second. There's actually a fairly simple way to mobilize them. I want to give it to you. Because most of us already do it. So, increase exercise, caloriec restriction. And that's it. Then, you actually increase the mobilization of a very small stem cells as well. So, they have found that if you reduce your caloriec intake, the body activates these very small stem cells. And if you do regular exercise, it activates them. If you consume, if you have too much insulin in your body, it actually stops the activation of those small stem cells.
Ben: Yeah. There's a lot more you can do than that for stem cell mobilization. I literally have over 20 compounds in my new book, “Boundless,” including things like colostrum, coffee, berry fruit extract, chlorella. There's a lot of stuff I found in writing that chapter. Shocked me how many natural compounds increase stem cell mobilization. So, I'm not going to tell people all of them. You got to go get the book.
Okay. So, another thing I talked about, actually, in that section of “Boundless” is NAD. And, I think, most of my listeners who have been listeners for any period of time are probably familiar with NAD, along with sirtuins. One of the best ways to support overall biological activity and, more specifically, those DNA repair mechanisms that we are talking about. And you also emailed me some information about a new way to boost NAD levels that I hadn't heard of before. Can you go into this one?
Marc: Yeah, really quick. So, right now, the way we try to increase NAD's with precursors and NMN, and what's the other thing?
Ben: Nicotinamide riboside, NR.
Marc: NR, correct, yeah. So, these are the two precursors. There is a doctor out of England who is also in the business of developing medications who has looked at energy production. And the way she approaches this, I think, is brilliant. She doesn't actually look at injecting precursors to help you produce your NAD. What she actually does is she changes the environment in your cells so that they can naturally produce NAD by itself. So, you don't have to run the precursors. So, it basically changes the environment of it.
And clinical studies have shown that you actually have, I think, it's after a few days, you have an NAD increase of 242% in your body over precursors. So, if you compare precursors, first off, you increase by 242% NAD.
Ben: Okay, got it.
Marc: You're not swallowing precursors.
Ben: Yeah, one clarification.
Marc: Change [00:59:54] _______ environment.
Ben: And a couple of questions about this. First of all, a lot of people don't realize your cells use NAD all the time in a form called NAD+. And that gets converted into a waste product. It's nicotinamide. And then, that gets recycled back into NAD by specific enzymes, including one that's upregulated with exercise and fasting. And so, that recycling process works throughout the body. But, as you age, that recycling of nicotinamide back into NAD becomes downregulated. And when you take NR or NMN or get an NAD IV, you're kind of covering that up with a band-aid but you're not necessarily restoring [01:00:31] ______ that salvage pathway.
However, I have never really heard of a way to up-regulate that salvage pathway, aside from some of those things like exercise and fasting that I talked about. So, I'm curious what actual ingredients are being used in this product. I think it's called Nuchido. Is it the one you talked about?
Marc: Yeah, Nuchido. You're asking me about all the stuff that I just sent you. Again, no affiliation with it. Nothing. I'll put you in contact with her if you want to, so you can talk to her about it. I'm looking at it right now. It's nice and it's in their vitamin C, zinc. And then, there's a special botanical blend in there that basically supposedly creates the effects for your body to produce more NAD.
Ben: Is that one of those proprietary blend kind of things?
Marc: No. It's not at all. I can tell you silicon dioxide, rutin from Sophora Japonica flowers, black pepper fruit extract, alpha lipoic acid, niacin, blah, blah, blah. I'll send it over to you. You can put it in the shownotes. Again, no affiliation with it. I'm personally, since from my personal background, I like to look at it at a system approach. It's a better approach to increase, in my opinion, increase NAD over just doing precursors, because you're changing the system to do its own job, rather than putting a molecule into the system so that your body can use it. I'm not a fan of that. I'm not a fan of peptides or anything like that because, I think, it's just molecule-base tines. I think it's a little outdated as far as I'm concerned.
Ben: Yeah. I was able to find their blend as well. You're right. Green tea extract, parsley leaf powder, or black pepper fruit extract, zinc, alpha lipoic acid, and nicotinamide. Okay. So, they're basically just trying to upregulate the salvage pathway with some of these compounds.
What I'd be curious about is whether co-administration of this with NAD or NMN or NR, along with tracking of the methylation clock, like using the Horvath clock or even doing a SpectraCell telomere analysis, which are, in my opinion, two of the best ways that currently exist to quantify aging. Even though, both have their issues. I think, the methylation clock by Horvath and the SpectraCell telomere analysis are probably two of the best ways to track aging. I'd be curious to see if there's an impact versus the use of just like NMN or NR or NAD alone. I don't know if they've ever done studies on this thing.
Marc: Contact them. I'll put you in contact with them. Find out for your listeners. I'm sorry that I'm not too informed about this.
Ben: Oh, no. That's why I want to talk to you. I just wanted to kind of, at least, open up some of these conversations and turn people on to some of these new things that they might be unaware of.
Okay. So, that's interesting. That was called Nuchido, N-U-C-H-I-D-O, a way to increase your NAD salvage pathways. It's really interesting. And, by the way, as you're listening in, folks, I know many of you are kind of keen on this stuff and biohackers and on the cutting edge yourself. And if you have more information of your own to add or things that you found out about these products or technologies that we're talking about, you can add them in the shownotes over at BenGreenfieldFitness.com/newbiohacks.
Okay. So, a couple of other things you had emailed me about. One, I guess, is also related anti-aging and stem cells, which we've already discussed. And that was something called Stem Kine. What was that one?
Marc: Stem Kine is also a natural blend which upregulates the production of endothelial stem cells, which are the stem cells that basically are responsible for your blood vessels and the EGS. So, new productions of blood vessels around the body which, I thought, was really interesting because they also have an increase of, I think, a couple hundred percent in clinical studies.
Ben: You're probably talking about the endothelial progenitor cells.
Marc: Yes, correct.
Marc: They produce more. So, your bone marrow actually excretes more of those stem cells. And then, you have more free-floating stem cells in your blood. Then, again, because of a little bit of knowledge that I have with my other scientist people is if they're actually going to be used by the body, that hasn't really been found out yet. It just upregulates them. You have more in your blood. If your body actually uses them, it's a different question that I can't tell you. I would assume it does. Everyone has to be careful.
Ben: In the past, I have come across a couple of ways to do that. And that would be the use of pulsed electromagnetic field therapy that can actually increase production of these progenitor cells for the endothelium from the bone marrow, like regular use of pulsed electromagnetic field therapy; especially, if you have a device and you can apply it over a long bone with plenty of bone marrow like the femur, for example.
And then, the other one is the beta-glucans from mushrooms, like chaga and reishi and turkey tail, and some of these mushrooms. Those also increase these same factors. So, I'm wondering if they're using some similar type of products in this Stem Kine stuff.
Marc: I'll look it up. It's [01:05:56] ______.
Ben: Okay. All right. Here's the label on it. It's a vitamin. So, 2,000 international units of vitamin D3. And it looks like they're blending that with, again, another probiotic one. We keep coming back to probiotics. Lactobacillus fermentum. And then, beta-glucan. So, they've got beta-glucans in there, same as you find in the mushrooms. And ellagic acid from pomegranate. That's really interesting.
Actually, the probiotic that I use by Seed contains pomegranate seed extract. And the reason is because that is consumed by the bacteria in the gut and produces urolithin A which, in and of itself, is actually a very good longevity enhancing compound. And there's some really good studies on urolithin A. Yeah, I've seen so much good data on pomegranate. I know all the carnivore diet people out there who aren't a big fan of beta-glucans from mushrooms and hormetic defense mechanisms in pomegranates are going to have to figure out a different way to do this. But, it looks like an interesting blend. So, this one's called Stem Kine.
Marc: Stem Kine. And the cool thing is it's a stem cell research out of Panama, the International Institute of Stem Cells. They developed it.
Ben: Okay, got it.
Marc: So, they're really big into stem cells. They're in their clinic, like the MSC's and all this stuff that you have done as well.
Ben: Do you know who that is?
Marc: No, I don't know him personally, unfortunately.
Ben: There's one doctor and I think it's Neil Riordan. He was on Joe Rogan Show. And he's a big stem cell guy in Panama. Would he have been the guy?
Marc: That's exactly him, yes.
Ben: Okay, interesting. Cool.
Marc: I've been following the clinic for a very, very long time.
Ben: Okay, got it. Interesting. All sorts of cool things to look into. There are a couple more that you talked to me about. One was hydrogen. You're talking about hydrogen. And, obviously, I've talked about hydrogen water and, also, deuterium-depleted water as being two different ways to hack your water, so to speak, to either increase the anti-inflammatory potential because hydrogen-rich water is a selective antioxidants, in the case of deuterium to increase the stability the electron transport chain.
You emailed me about it. And, I think, folks who listen they're already pretty aware of the benefits of hydrogen and DDW, based on the podcast I've done in the past.
Marc: What kind of hydrogen?
Ben: What kind of hydrogen?
Marc: Yeah, how do you create your hydrogen and how do you consume it? Let me put it this way.
Ben: I've been using dissolved hydrogen tablets from Water Wellness.
Marc: With magnesium?
Ben: Yeah. They're combined with magnesium. And then, the other one is a hydrogen-generating machine. With my own internal testing, it produces appreciable amounts, high ppm of hydrogen-rich water. And so, I've got one of those in my basement. And when I travel, I use these hydrogen water tablets.
Marc: I'm not a fan of the tablets with the magnesium in there because it's a weird concept. I don't know. I'm not a fan of that. Talked to a friend of mine about it. He basically said, “Look, stay away from the magnesium tablets because you're consuming other things with it. And too much magnesium is also not the best situation. So, it's easier to just create it yourself with electrolysis.” That's his take on it.
Ben: You mean using hydrogen water generator?
Marc: If that's what they are called, yeah. I mean, electrolysis produces hydrogen. If that's what the machines are called, then, that's what it is, yeah.
Ben: Okay. And so, how are you consuming hydrogen?
Ben: Okay. Is there a specific machine that you're using?
Marc: Yeah. But again, I don't want to name it. I'll send that machine to you. I don't want to name it because I don't want anyone thinking I'm name dropping stuff. But, yeah, it's done with lye, with the soap. So, basically, as a catalyst, it uses very, very minimal amounts of energy compared to all other electrolysis out there. It's a very interesting device because you can actually adjust the output of hydrogen. So, I don't know if your device does that; but most devices, they just produce hydrogen and then you're done.
But, you actually have to make sure that you don't get too much hydrogen if you're breathing it, at least, that you don't get too much hydrogen into your body because as soon as you reach over 4%, you're a walking bomb.
Ben: I think that the water machine I'm using does indeed operate based on electrolysis. But, also, with the magnesium piece, what the magnesium does is it reacts with H2O and that produces H2. But then, the magnesium gets converted into ionic magnesium when that happens. That's a pretty bioavailable form of magnesium. And considering that a lot of people are magnesium deficient, I've never really had an issue with that because, essentially, you have the buffering effects in the tablet that reduces the hydroxide and then separates it from the magnesium. So, you basically have free magnesium ions and free hydrogen ions when you use magnesium as a carrier for molecular hydrogen.
So, I've always thought that magnesium-based hydrogen tablets were actually a pretty good idea. I don't run into a lot of people who have like excess magnesium levels.
Marc: The thing is if you're using magnesium tablets, you're just using magnesium tablets, if you're using it on an electrolysis device and you're running Brown's gas from Brown, there's actually a different kind of gas that comes with it.
Ben: But, I'm not running it on the electrolysis. I'm just taking the tablet and putting it into water.
Marc: Correct. But, the thing is, with the hydrogen gas, you're drinking hydrogen water, right?
Marc: So, if you're running it through an electrolysis system and then you basically, let's call it, bubble your water. It actually creates water plasma that you're drinking which you don't get from the magnesium tablets.
Ben: You're right. Like drinking water from a hydrogen generator that uses hydrogen electrolysis is always going to be superior. It's just like when you're on an airplane or whatever. You don't try to get some of the anti-inflammatory benefits of hydrogen. You're not going to have a water generator with you. So, I kind of use the water generator at home. And then, I travel with the tablets. And so, that seems to work out pretty well. I'm probably getting more hydrogen ppm in my water at home than I am when I'm traveling. But, I'm still getting some of those magnesium tablets when I travel.
Marc: Okay. Well, that's fair enough. I guess, from a convenience standpoint, it's easier. I just like the idea of having the electrically expanded water which is, basically, what a plasma that you're drinking, which studies have shown that when you consume electrically expanded water, you have a higher hydrogen concentration of up to 10 times in your blood when you drink it, compared to when you breathe it. But, when you breathe it, you have a higher concentration of hydrogen throughout your system which is not transported through the blood. So, you can't want to do both.
Ben: Got it.
Marc: You don't want to just drink or just breathe. You want to run both systems simultaneously. And it's really, really good thing because. Basically, we're 62% hydrogen by volume. So, it's your largest macronutrient that you can consume, hydrogen. There's nothing else that you need to consume. You need hydrogen. You need a little bit of oxygen. You need a little bit of carbon. And then, 2% is all the rest that you and I have talked about earlier.
Ben: Yeah. And, really, back to the idea of photons, one thing I have been learning in this human photosynthesis book that I'm reading is that the photonic splitting of water that occurs, obviously when you're out in the sunlight or using one of these photobiomodulation units like a red and near-infrared light generator, that actually splits the water molecule in a way that creates free hydrogen. And so, again, if you're getting light exposure, you're actually going to get appreciable amounts of free hydrogen, just from making sure that you're getting out in sunlight in a well-hydrated state. So, it's interesting that a lot of this stuff from a purely ancestral standpoint is free, especially when you consider that spring water is naturally structured more electrically charged water, which is more conducive to this splitting effect. So, you drink good, clean, pure water and get good light exposure, get good minerals in your system as well. And even if you can't afford a hydrogen water generator or regular use of hydrogen water tablets, you're still going to be getting pretty good effect.
Marc: They're not that expensive, I mean, considering from a cost-benefit analysis.
Ben: I think mine retailed at $8,000 or something.
Marc: It's a rip-off. It shouldn't cost you more than $2,000.
Marc: Honestly. That shouldn't cost you more than $2,000, $2,500.
Ben: Well, I no longer promote the company that I got that unit from, anyways, again, because I think that they were scamming some people. So, it could have been overpriced, to start with.
Marc: They use it in Japan and in China quite a bit, do you know?
Ben: Oh, yeah. China.
Marc: You really need to look in the engineering of those machines that you don't want the PSI pressure inside run too high because you're basically having a bomb in your apartment. So, there's a lot to think. Hydrogen is really, really freaking dangerous. So, I can only encourage your listeners be careful what you buy because you do not want a little small hydrogen bomb in your apartment.
Ben: Yeah, true. Reminds me of a conversation I have with my kids the other day, because they're training for their first jiu-jitsu tournament right now and they've been using the hyperbaric oxygen chamber that we have in the basement downstairs. And I realized I hadn't yet informed them that pressurized oxygen can be highly flammable. And they're really into little torch devices and things like that right now. And so, I warned them not to bring their blowtorches and their books into the HBOT chamber.
Marc: Yeah. Are your kids using hydrogen as well, hydrogen water ingredient?
Ben: They drink from the unit downstairs. But, primarily, because it's right next to all their Legos. So, they'll play Legos like hours during the day and they'll be drinking hydrogen-rich water while they're playing Legos.
Marc: Just as an add-on, it's really important that you drink it and breathe it because both systems have a different effect on the body.
Ben: That's interesting. And I know some of these units are now coming with an inhalation feature as well.
Marc: You can use it for topical appliances as well. You can just, I don't know, put a plastic bag around your arm and then put the little gas in there to make sure it gets to your skin. Taking baths in it, personally.
Ben: Yeah. Well, Water and Wellness, they actually sell the bath bombs too. So, in my float tank, I have a hydrogen water generator. I forget where I got it, but it basically infuses hydrogen into the water. But then, kind of like these water tablets that you can dissolve in water and drink, they sell bath tablets too. I think, Water and Wellness has those. I'll hunt it down and link to them in the shownotes. You can take a bath. You can put some salts in the water and then take a bath and add hydrogen water tablets too and get that skin absorption effect.
Marc: What it does, for a lot of different aging, it actually allows your body, if you do the baths, they have done studies where your body actually starts producing more collagen. So, you should get rid of wrinkles.
Ben: That's cool. A lot of this stuff flies on the radar. I think it's pretty cool.
So, one other thing I wanted to ask you about was you told me, and this is, again, kind of related to quantum physics. So, I realized some of this stuff can be difficult to explain. But, it's related to water. And this was something that you had found that could be used to increase the ability of like seeds that might be sprouting in water to increase the mineral density of plants that are grown using this water that's been treated with a specific device. I think, it was called an Ark.
Marc: Yes, an Ark Crystal. So, that goes into quantum physics. Actually, it has something to do with unified field theory. So, what that device does–okay, let's back it up. I'm going to see how we can we start on that one. So, you have the vacuum, the vacuum of space, which has a specific geometric structure. And I think a lot of people or your listeners know about that. It's a tetrahedral structure. And what the tetrahedral structure does, it basically condenses energy on all angles of that structure into a single point. So, no matter where you put pressure on the geometric structure, the pressure is always equalized into the center where it basically creates singularity based upon what quantum physics believes no one knows. This is all theory.
And this structure, believe it or not, if you look at the structure of the vacuum and compare it with genuinely real structured water, they're similar. So, they have the exact same structure. The structure of the vacuum and the structure of really coherent water, they are exactly the same. The problem is we don't really get coherent water anywhere because it's contaminated, there's other frequencies around, whatever. So, you never have real coherent structured water. You cannot really buy it. It's like a double helix water.
Ben: Unless you actually have a structured water generator installed in your home.
Marc: Which I highly doubt that that actually works.
Marc: That's my personal.
Ben: Why do you doubt that it works?
Marc: Because it's a mechanical process that tries to structure it. And so, you don't use the inherent feature of the water to structure itself.
Ben: Okay. From my understanding with structured water generators, they're actually using small crystalline minerals that the water passes through. Or, sometimes, they'll use glass beads in a crystalline structure.
Marc: Oh, yeah. But, that's vortex.
Ben: Yeah, the vortex in the water, yeah.
Marc: That's a different process, though. That creates a different kind of, I want to say a different kind of water because I'm sure that the effects are similar. Here, a friend of mine is doing this, too, for farmers. So, they're using a special, let's call it a filter that has these bubbles. And it creates vortex water. And then, they water their plants with it and they have an increased factor of two or three.
Ben: Not just the plants. It also works on livestock. I know this because my dad is in the structured water industry and he works with large agricultural organizations and, then, also, livestock operations. And they're seeing increase not only in plant growth and mineral density, but also the growth of the livestock themselves upon consumption of this water.
Marc: It's crazy. Well, it's the same with hydrogen as well. Sorry, I'm going back to that. It actually increases the growth of livestock by a factor of three. Fish grows three times faster, and all the stuff.
Ben: So, this Ark Crystal, basically, it's using this idea of quantum vacuum, meaning it would be mildly oscillating like a crystal does.
Marc: Yeah. Every crystal oscillates. Every crystal has a certain frequency. Maybe, that's why these crystal healings things work or you could assume that. So, you need all ways in order to get information from A to B. You need a conduit. You need a transport system. So, the vacuum in itself has no, or at least to our current understanding, has no direct way of communicating with the water to tell it to structure itself. So, you need a conduit that can pick up the vibration, this very, very minor vibrations of the vacuum and basically structure the water with that. And that's the Ark Crystal. And that's a specific crystal that has been grown. It's lab-grown. I think there's 35 years of research that went into that. And it lives in a palladium shell on magnet, so it actually floats. So, it doesn't really touch the ground or anything. It actually floats.
And this crystal, what it does if you place it close to any organism that has water in it–plants, humans, water in itself–and transmits the information to basically allow the water to come back to its original structure, to get input. The crystal vibrates in the same frequency as the vacuum vibrates and the water, then, picks that up and can change itself. And during that process when it changes itself, which I thought was always very, very interesting, is you had a germination increase with plants by 43,000%.
Marc: Which is like you want to think, it's insane.
Ben: Do they actually have this research on their website?
Marc: No, I can send you the research paper.
So, you have wheatgrass nutrition density of something like 23,000%.
Ben: Wow, geez.
Marc: So, the nutrient density of the plants, at least the plants that have been tested. Not all plants have been tested. There's just not enough money there to do all the tests on all the plants. But, maybe, someone should, good point. But, the germination is insane. Growth factor is crazy. It grows something like 400 or 500% quicker. And the nutrient density is better. When you treat it with that water which I find staggering is you do not need pesticides. So, the defense mechanisms of the plans are actually activated. So, when there are germs or whatever that would usually kill the plants in the normal environment, you don't need it anymore.
And that has something to do with, as far as I believe, is that once the water is 100% coherent, the organism can actually fully use it. So, when you drink a glass of water right now, that water is definitely not coherent. We both know that. And your body wastes a lot of energy of structuring the water himself or itself. The body has to structure the water in the right, it's called a geometric structure, in order to be used. So, I firmly believe that's what the body does. But, if you actually give it the prime water, then, it doesn't have to structure itself and can save up on energy and actually can work on other processes and apply that energy for other processes.
Ben: And to clarify, this crystal, this Ark Crystal, you would simply purchase one and you would keep, I would imagine, a large glass container of water that you are going to drink sitting on top of it or something like that.
Marc: Yeah. You can put it on top of it, side of it. You can throw it inside of it. Just keep it fairly close.
Ben: Right. You could even, I would imagine, a big glass carboy and just have that as a water dispenser and keep this Ark Crystal next to it if you weren't going to use a vortex or something like that to structure your water.
Marc: Yeah, you can do it. And then, you coupled it with DDP depleted water. And I don't think you've ever seen bigger plants and you're like–
Ben: Yeah. A lot of people actually do that with their hydrogen water generators or other forms of waters. They'll buy deuterium-depleted water and, again, Water and Wellness is another company that I know sells that, and then, they'll add small amounts of the deuterium-depleted water to a glass carboy or a water filter. And so, whatever form of water filtration or water structure that they're using, they're also simultaneously getting deuterium-depleted water. And that, in my opinion, is a very good strategy as far as really upgrading the water that you're drinking. So, do you use this thing, by the way, the Ark Crystal?
Marc: Yeah. I carry it around. You can just carry it as a necklace if you want to, because it has an effect.
Ben: Oh, it's that small.
Marc: Yeah. It's not big. It's just too expensive to make it bigger because they're artificially growing crystals and they're making sure that the structures are correct because it's like 3D printing it, you cannot have an arrow. If you have one small arrow inside, the entire thing just that goes bust because it changes the vibrational frequency of that particular crystal. So, it's a really, really complex process.
Ben: I have a question for you as we get close to wrapping up. What's the primary method where you're discovering a lot of stuff? Do you go into specific conferences? Are there journals you're subscribed to? Or, what's the method via which you're kind of finding all of this stuff? Or, it's coming across your plate?
Marc: There's a lot of people that are asking if that's something you go to invest in. And there's other people that are coming to me, know me through channels, if I may have money for them to invest. So, it's all from a money perspective.
Ben: But, you're not investing in any of these companies we just talked about?
Marc: No, no, no. I have not said them. I have not mentioned any company that I'm directly invested in or can even remotely make it, because I don't want that conflict of interest. There's things that I have invested in, but I'm not going to talk about it here because it just doesn't work.
Ben: Okay. Got it. What's a non-negotiable for you? What's something that you're doing every single day? Like for me, I'd say if I could pick one thing that's a huge game-changer for me right now, it's just my daily sauna and ice protocol. That's, in my opinion, something that I just immediately feel and I absolutely love the research behind heat and cold. But, what's one thing that you're doing that it's just non-negotiable for you?
Marc: Hydrogen water. Breathing hydrogen gas and drinking electrically expanded water. That's it.
Marc: 62% of your body. I mean, anything else, in the end, if you look into the science of it, there's so much research on it. Everyone should have it. That's my personal opinion.
Ben: Yeah. Also, they are hard to find these days.
Ben: I said that's not that hard to find these days, hydrogen water like we're just talking about.
Marc: No. Just like I said, you just want to make sure that you have a device that doesn't kill you. You want to have a device where you can basically put in your height and your volume, your body volume. So, you don't overexpose yourself with too much hydrogen. You want to make sure that the filtration systems are correct from the electrolysis standpoint. And that's about it. I mean, those are the things that you have to be careful. And you want to drink and breathe it.
Ben: Yeah, cool.
Marc: I'll put you in contact with the guy, Ben. He's been doing this hydrogen research since the mid-'70s and has been building these devices since the mid-'70s. And then, you can talk to him. Maybe, you want to bring him on the show.
Ben: Yeah. Let me talk to them. I, in the passive interview, Tyler LeBaron from the Molecular Hydrogen Foundation and then Robert Slovak from Water and Wellness. And I'll link to those two podcasts in the shownotes for people who really want to become super knowledgeable ninjas on all things hydration and water, or hydrogen water. Certainly, if you sent over any of the research papers we talked about, any additional information, all that stuff, if you send it over in the next couple of days, I think I'm going to actually publish this interview pretty quickly within the next couple of days after you and I are chatting.
So, if you send me over some stuff over the next couple of days, I'll include that in the shownotes which, for those of you listening in, is going to be at BenGreenfieldFitness.com/newbiohacks. That's BenGreenfieldFitness.com/newbiohacks.
Well, Marc, I have managed to spend an hour and a half in a coffee shop without drinking a single cup of [01:31:00] ______ Starbucks coffee. So, I hope I'm not getting a dirty [01:31:04] ______ of baristas for not being a paying customer. So, I'm going to go buy some water or something like that after we finish up here.
Ben: Cool, man. Thank you so much for coming on the show. This has been a very interesting discussion.
Marc: Okay. Thank you so much for inviting me onto it and if there's something else that comes across my table, I'll shoot you an email.
Ben: For sure. All right, folks. Well, I'm Ben Greenfield.
Marc: I just have one thing.
Ben: Oh, go ahead.
Marc: Quick one. Because your thing is longevity, living longer, just breathing hydrogen increases lifespan by 50%.
Ben: Send me that research.
Marc: I'll send it to you.
Ben: Okay. [01:31:44] ______, Marc. I'll talk to you later.
Well, thanks for listening to today's show. You can grab all the shownotes, the resources, pretty much everything that I mentioned, over at BenGreenfieldFitness.com, along with plenty of other goodies from me, including the highly helpful “Ben Recommends” page, which is a list of pretty much everything that I've ever recommended for hormone, sleep, digestion, fat loss, performance, and plenty more. Please, also know that all the links, all the promo codes that I mentioned during this and every episode, helped to make this podcast happen and to generate income that enables me to keep bringing you this content every single week. So, when you listen in, be sure to use the links in the shownotes, use the promo codes that they generate because that helps to float this thing and keep it coming to you each and every week.
Strap yourselves in for a wild biohacking ride full of new biohacks—some of which I hadn't even heard of.
My guest on today's podcast is named Marc. That's it. That's the only information I'll release about his identity.
He started his career in investment banking and financing renewable energies and now arranges financing for various government projects—from hydro dams, to farms, to airports—and is now heavily immersed in the fields of biohacking and researching emerging health-enhancing technologies, primarily inspired by managing an incurable genetic defect in his kidneys.
In this podcast, we delve into a host of new biohacking technologies you've probably never heard of, from NAD boosters, to stem cell enhancing protocols, to longevity and anti-aging molecules, and much more!
During this discussion, you'll discover:
-How Marc got interested in these biohacks…8:03
- Doing due diligence for banking investments revealed a lot of flaws in technologies such as solar and wind power
- Became a trusted voice among his partners and investors due to his findings
-How to change the gravitational pull inside your cells to speed up the healing process…11:38
- Marc was diagnosed w/ polycystic kidney disease (PKD)
- Defective on PK-1 protein; cysts develop on the kidney
- Standard medicine considers it incurable
- Began ketogenic diet (low glucose slows the growth of the cysts)
- Increase in klotho protein halts the disease
- Changes the gravitational pull inside the cells, thus changing the time perspective in which they can heal (40 hrs of healing w/in a 24 hr time frame)
- Immortalis probiotic
- Very expensive: ~$2500/month
- Extremely detail-oriented protocol
- Use olive oilor yogurt as a precursor approx. 3-4 days before ingesting
- How the klotho protein is activated and suppressed
- Psychological stress, inflammation, oxidative stress and depression mitigate its production
- Angiotensin decreases klotho
- Vitamin D, insulin, exercise (resistance training), cordyceps, ginseng extract, activated charcoal increase klotho
- Vitamin D transport system activates immune system
- Nagalase enzyme suppresses the immune system by suppressing immune cells
- GcMAF mitigates damage done by nagalase
-Ways to protect from harmful 5G technology…32:15
- EMF doesn't actually attack human DNA; it attacks and changes the DNA of the gut microbiome, with an effect on the brain
- Immortalis probioticcan withstand 5G
- BluShield device
- Somavedic device
- 5G Bio Shield
-The skinny on V-cells…44:30
- V-cells are totipotent cells
- Different types of cells:
- Totipotent cells can become any type of cell (the crème de la crème of stem cells)
- Pluripotent can be a variety of different cells
- Multipotent cells, less variety
- Singular potent – only one type of cell
- Embryonic-like stem cells
- “Non-activated”—dormant, body doesn't know what to do with them
- Device in the works to increase bioavailability of V-cells
- High-frequency pulse laser
- Very small margin of error for it to be efficacious
- BGF podcasts mentioned:
- Increased exercise and caloric restriction will mobilize small v-cells
-A mostly unknown way to boost NAD levels…58:02
- Change the environment so that cells produce NAD sans precursors (such as nicotinamide riboside, NR)
- NADincrease of 242%
- NAD+ is used by the body, then converted into NR
- This becomes downregulated w/ age
- Nuchidofor boosting NAD
-A natural way to upregulate endothelial stem cells…1:03:55
-Interesting biohacks related to water…1:07:42
- Water And Wellness magnesium tablets(code: GREENFIELD)
- Water And Wellness hydrogen water drinking tablets(code: GREENFIELD)
- Water And Wellness hydrogen bath tablets(code: GREENFIELD)
- Hydrogen is very dangerous; use it with caution when drinking hydrogen-enriched water
-A device that increases the mineral density of plants…1:18:03
- Ark Crystals
- Placed close to organism w/ water, allows water to come back to its original structure
- Pesticides are not necessary
- Water becomes 100% coherent
- Water and Wellness deuterium-depleted water
-And much more…
Resources from this episode:
– The BluShield device (code: BEN)
– Book: The Human Photosynthesis
– Book: Boundless
– Nuchido for boosting NAD
– Water And Wellness hydrogen water drinking tablets (code: GREENFIELD)
– Water And Wellness hydrogen bath tablets (code: GREENFIELD)
– Water And Wellness Deuterium Depleted Water (code: GREENFIELD)
– BGF podcasts mentioned:
The following links are research articles and reports sent to Ben by our guest.
– Reports on Low Deuterium Water
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–Seed Daily Synbiotic: A formulation of 24 unique strains, each of which included at their clinically verified dose, to deliver systemic benefits in the body. Save 15% off your order when you use discount code: BEN15
–kApex: kApex breaks down the fats you eat into fatty acids, which allows you to increase the fatty acid oxidation inside your mitochondria both in your muscle and liver. Get 20% off your order when you use coupon code: GREENFIELDKX
–Four Sigmatic: I’ve been using Four Sigmatic products for a while now and I’m impressed by the efficacies of their mushroom products. I use them. I like them. I support the mission! Receive 15% off your Four Sigmatic purchase when you use discount code: BENGREENFIELD