May 26, 2022
[00:02:27] Podcast Sponsors
[00:04:51] The panelists' views on detoxification
[00:16:44] Subtle symptoms of an over-toxified person
[00:20:59] The best way to re-mineralize the body
[00:23:11] Recommendations for quality sleep and recovery while you sleep
[00:28:50] Podcast Sponsors
[00:32:49] Liver sauce to detox
[00:37:03] Detox options for pregnant and breastfeeding women
[00:39:56] Thoughts on swimming in chlorinated pools
[00:41:48] Detox strategies for children
[00:48:52] Parasympathetic/sympathetic balance
[00:51:23] Upcoming Event
[00:52:55] End of Podcast
Ben: My name is Ben Greenfield. And, on this episode of the Ben Greenfield Life podcast.
And so, that means 57 times a year I'm getting pretty good clean up. And, I've been doing that for about three years and I feel really good.
Chris: And, some of them are interpersonal, and some of them are chemical, and some of them are immunological. And then, there's the maximize as much as you can.
When it is fight or flight, then you have the toxic reactions you look at somebody and you're my source of toxins, you're my source of pain.
Ben: Faith, family, fitness, health, performance, nutrition, longevity, ancestral living, biohacking, and a whole lot more. Welcome to the show.
Hello. Ben Greenfield here. The episode you're about to hear was recorded live at a fantastic event called RUNGA, R-U-N-G-A. It's a very intimate comprehensive wellness event consisting of waking up in the morning and doing kundalini yoga and meditation, ice baths, to fantastic organic breakfasts, and kettlebell workouts, meditations, hyperbaric oxygen therapy, IVs, injections, electrical treatments, biohacks, you name it, it's all there. You just basically spend three days optimizing your body. And, in the evening, there's panels and special dinners. And, what you're about to hear is a panel that was recorded at that event, a panel on detoxification that I was on along with Dr. Leland Stillman and Dr. Chris Shade, two previous podcast guests, and Jason Sonners, also a previous podcast guest and the guy who runs a hyperbaric oxygen chamber company, HBOT USA. And, we just had a fantastic chat. So, stay tuned for that.
And, if you want to check out the RUNGA event, you can go to BenGreenfieldLife.com/RUNGA and take a look at it, surf around, apply for this next RUNGA event, which is going to occur in October in Austin, Texas if you want to be a part of it. But, even if you don't, you're going to get a lot of today's show. So, enjoy.
Oh, one last thing, the shownotes for everything you're about to hear, you can find at BenGreenfieldLife.com/RUNGAQA. That's BenGreenfieldLife.com/R-U-N-G-A-QA.
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Female: I just wanted to say before we kick off because this is the last night, I wanted to say thank you so much to all of you because this has been so beautiful and such an amazing time. I'm so grateful for every single one of you and every single one of you, and just the exchanges that have been happening and the beautiful moments of connection that I've experienced and that I've witnessed and that I know is happening every single second that we've all been here together. So, thank you all so much.
I will start the panel by perhaps taking — Well, actually, you guys tell me, would you like to start with a question from the audience or would you like to start with maybe a brief introduction to how you view detoxification? Because I know Dr. Stillman, I would like him to go first.
Leland: My spiel is very, very simple and brief. Not that I couldn't talk about this for a really long time but it just amazes me how I think people get very caught in the weeds with detox. I get hundreds of panels back on patients every year that test a broad swath of detoxification markers, not only the toxins themselves but then your ability to metabolize and excrete them. And, that allows me, then in consultation with the patient, to also evaluate what symptoms they actually have from that. So, I've been very amused when somebody comes in and they have tinnitus and a metallic taste in their mouth, and vertigo, and they're depressed, and they feel confused sometimes, have brain fog and insomnia. And, I'm like, “Well, this probably has something to do with your mercury level of 13 and the fact that you live in Seattle, Washington, and you think seafood is good for you, which is true, but eating the high mercury fish for you right now is something you got to put a pause on.” And, it's funny because in my practice with my colleagues, it became a running joke how if you had a 30- to 50-year-old woman coming in with some swath of symptoms who likes to wear yoga pants more than three days a week, there's a solid chance she's going to have a high mercury level because she loves the spicy tuna roll with her girlfriends at least once a week.
Yeah. So, what I focus on first with people that has the most profound impact, and sometimes I don't have to get much deeper than this because I have so much to do with people with how much I look at in their life and diet and so on and so forth is the simple stuff. Lots of people who are coming to me with abnormal tox panels have an exposure. I've had guys come through who were metallurgists and they had high zinc levels because they were working in galvanization and they've been really exposed to zinc, then they get the advice they need to take zinc in order to stop their COVID, and they wind up with a level that's 250, but you really only need 125. And then, I'm like, “Well, do you have nausea, and vomiting, and diarrhea, or headaches, or any of the other malaise of zinc toxicity?” And, they're like, “As a matter of fact I do.” I'm like, “Okay, we can stop the supplement now, you've definitely got enough on board.” And then, simple things like, “Are you pooping every day? Maybe you need to be pooping more than once a day.” You can get into the binders and stuff like that and I'll let Dr. Shade opine on that because he'll geek out over the pharmacokinetics and dynamics, right?
And then, so on and things like that. But, one of the other things that's come through to me in my practice is I'll have patients who are worried about being toxed and they'll do a lot of sauna without understanding where their mineral balance is and then they'll wind up with low mineral levels that are creating other symptoms that aren't fixed by sauna or they're temporarily fixed by sauna. So, I really like to dial everything in as far as how much they're doing of different therapeutic modalities, detox, et cetera, et cetera. And then, always, the trend overwhelmingly is if someone's got a real problem with toxins in their body, they've got issues with some combination of micronutrients, methylation cofactors like B vitamins, certain amino acids, and then the minerals are where — they're my favorite. I can't get over how cool minerals are and how powerful they can be therapeutically.
So, those are my thoughts on detox in five minutes or less.
Ben: Cool. I don't know very much about detoxification, honestly. I think that like Leland alluded to, sometimes it can be, in many cases, a little bit of a matter of simple lifestyle practices. And, I like that approach because it seems there's this tendency, in the same way that people go on their new year's resolution, to lose a bunch of weight after they've gained some fat all year long. They will build up toxins and build up toxins, build up toxins, and then some practitioner or some test or their own intuition will tell them I'll go do a detoxification protocol now and they'll do some intense three, four, five weeks, three months type of spendy supplementation protocol. And, those have their time in their place if you're really overloaded and if you've dug yourself into a hole. But, I think that just looking at your day-to-day habits, how you live your day is how you live your life and engaging in simple detoxification strategies each day. And, I don't profess to have any clinical research behind this approach, but for me, every single morning, I jump up and down on a trampoline four to five times a week. I do a deep sweat in the infrared sauna. Once a week I'll have what I literally call a detox morning where I'll take a binder and I'll do a coffee enema and then go into the sauna and get a little bit of a deeper sweat in the sauna. And so, that means 57 times a year, I'm getting pretty good cleanup. And, I've been doing that for about three years and I feel really good on that. And, I have a lot of my clients do a similar practice where you just have once a week, you do a little bit extra TLC and every day or at least most days of the week. You try to do some rebounding or at least some tai chi shaking or something like that. You try to get a deep sweat in. You keep moving. And, even something as simple as going on a walk and swinging your arms, pump lymphs. I think I need to tell anybody in here to not live a sedentary lifestyle and you're all very active. And so, you have that figured out. But, those are a few little things that I do that seem to keep things work in order.
Jason: Yes and yes. And, to add to that, I'd say, we look at it a few different ways. There are the toxin loads that we all have in our life. And so, we talk about toxicity and sufficiency. Do you have too much of the things that are in your body that are hurting you? And, do you have enough of the things in your body that your body needs to actually heal and recover and regenerate? So, we always want to look at both sides of that equation. And, I think that the toxins that affect you are the same toxins that affect us and they're all in our environment. And so, sometimes we want to look at that and say, “Why are two people –” let's say you have a family of five and they're in a moldy house, but only two of them are expressing terrible symptoms and the other three seem they're doing okay. And, the reality to some of that is just how resilient are you as compared to somebody else or how well do you handle certain toxins versus somebody else.
And so, while we definitely focus on detox and detox pathways, we do ongoing detoxification strategies like what Ben was saying, we do more advanced detoxification strategies, like what Leland was mentioning. And, at the same time, we should always be looking at what are the things we could be doing to make ourselves more resilient period so that we can actually tolerate. It's unlikely that we're going to be able to eliminate all the toxins in our environment. So, if we can't eliminate all the toxins in our environment, yes, we should have strategies for dealing with that and what else can we do to become the strongest healthiest most resilient versions of ourselves so that we can become more tolerant of our environment and thereby hopefully have less issues as a result.
Chris: You see when we talk, first guy, he's got all these people coming to him, and a lot of people got all kinds of low-hanging fruit like, “I'm deficient on this, I'm efficient on that, I'm deficient on that.” And so, you run a broad panel on them, see they're missing this, that, and the other thing because they do all these crazy things. They're hypersupplemented on this and they're undersupplemented on that. And so, that's the sort of get the game back rolling and take the obvious things out of the way. Ben is talking about the lifestyle stuff, the day to day to day to day that keeps you clean. And, that's all that Ben's going to need. But, in the beginning, Ben did certain interventional protocols.
And then, we get to talking about resilience. And, resilience is part of the day-to-day things. So, when we talk about detoxification, like you said, in one house, two are bad, two are fine. Why is that? And so, we tend to cast that too much into this fixed game of, “Well, that's my genetic predisposition to be able to detoxify or not.” But, our ability to detoxify and what everybody's suggesting is that you're not going to get rid of all the toxins from your life, they're going to come in. You're going to have to be able to deal with them.
And so, you've got this cellular machinery that's going to push away, it's going to kick the toxin out, and out, and out, out of the cell. And, when that cellular machinery is tired because of things it's not getting, I mean, it's maybe severely deficient in something or there may be inflammation because inflammation and detoxification are fundamental opposites, detoxification relies on this internal antioxidant system. But, when inflammation is happening, you actually turn down your internal antioxidant system because you want to keep this pro-oxidant thing going. So, you've got these things that are lowering you or elevating you. When you've got a strong inflammation, you're bringing down the toxification regardless of your genes. And then, if you have genes that are working against you, then you've got a double negative. And, you can raise all of that and you can work against these things.
And, sometimes in the beginning, like Ben said, you get into a hole, you need a formal system. And, we have to touch all these things, we have to bring down that inflammation and then we've got to upregulate a cellular level, we've got to upregulated liver level. And, this is one of the simplest things that we miss all the time is that toxin transport out of the liver is coordinated and coupled to bile transport. The transporters that put bile into the bile tract to go down your gallbladder, go into your small intestine to help you digest are the same things that are moving toxins out of the system. So, just upregulating that bile flow and getting that out. Liver level is a really big thing. And, sometimes people have just gone too far and you need to do a formal detoxification for a couple of weeks or months, and then you have to incorporate long-range, what are you going to do after that.
And, there's a number of things from the bio flow, it got out quite a bit, the whole ability to move lymph. And, Ben actually came over and today, you had a lymphatic movement thing, and he came over, he said, “I got to get some binder.” Every time you have a massage, you're moving things into circulation. And then, the fog you feel afterward, you need to bind or you need to pee, but you poop, pee, and bile and everything starts moving out. So, sometimes there's formal, there's ongoing and it's lifestyle. And, it's these things like poopy shit, sweat.
Male: Write that down.
Chris: Alright, we're on to questions. Evan number one.
Evan: So, the first question is, what are some of the subtle symptoms of an over-toxified person? Not like you're in dire need or whatever, and maybe give us the spectrum of what are the symptoms of over-toxicity.
Chris: I'll start move it down the line. But, from a couple of systems, the toxicity mostly on a neurological level switches you into glutamate excess and sympathetic overdrive despite being foggy because of the inflammation that's up there. So, this sort of come down and lack of clarity, the fog is over, but you're hyperstimulated and you're not sure why it's always like that and you're anxious. And then, at a cellular level, it's the energy generation machine generally and that's mitochondria at a cellular level, it's thyroid and adrenal at a glandular level. And so, it's turning down and it's a little foggy. When it goes from there worse, it gets a little bit more dysregulated.
Jason: What Chris is trying to say is brain fog, fatigue, trouble sleeping.
Ben: Electro hypersensitivity is another one that seems to pop up. Was really interesting a lot of times with metal toxicity, it's almost as though your body turns into a giant antenna and you get sympathetically driven around Wi-Fi routers and the like. So, that's a hidden symptom —
Chris: And, a lot of that is happening. They're always trying to figure out where that's happening, is it demyelination, and they never see that. But, at an autonomic level, all that stuff's pushing through the extracellular matrix and that's all set up into this perfect gel structure like a crystal gel, and then the toxins get in there and deregulate that. And, that's where, I think, the gel when it's correctly formed is the insulation on the autonomic or nerves under the wire. And, when the toxins get in and damage the extracellular matrix, that's the insulation you lose and that's where that autonomic antenna starts to vibrate.
Jason: Places where there's a lot of Wi-Fi, you go into hotels. If you really want to test yourself out, just go down to Vegas. And, not for all the other reasons that Vegas stresses you, but you go into the casinos and they have a cell phone on every one of the slot machines and they all communicate that way. They figured out that was the best way to go. So, you got super-high levels there. And so, that'll blow you out and stuff. Not that that's ever really good for you, but you'll be crumbled.
Evan: Fundamental detoxifying tool [00:19:41] _____.
Ben: Oh, my gosh, that's easy. For me the sauna for sure. The infrared sauna too just because you get a little bit of a deeper sweat. And, you can hear it's funny, you might be able to hear the vibration platform going there in the background, in the garage. And, that or the trampoline would be a close second. I mean, I have a mini trampoline in the room right next to my office, and I go in there with pomodoro breaks and jump up and down. And then, in the gym, I got one of those vibration platforms and I stand on that thing almost every day. When I walk by the gym, I'll just duck in there and stand on for a couple minutes. And so, I would say vibrating in the heat.
Jason: Yeah. If I was going to do physical versions, I'd say vibration-like lymphatic flow. Any movement is just pumping that lymphatic system. If I was going to say chemically, something benign because what happens is people jump into different binders and different thing, whatever they're trying to detoxify. They don't realize that sometimes they're bringing things up to the surface too and they get lit up just as much as from the actual chemicals that they're trying to get out of their body. But, for me, I think charcoal is one of those things that in small amounts on a regular basis can be pretty gentle, can get some of the low-hanging fruit and move things through the system without setting somebody off.
Male: With regards to the sauna work and the depletion of minerals, what's the easiest way to re-mineralize your body?
Chris: Yeah. We use the ocean minerals. We really like those a lot. But, you're going to need a little bit more potassium, so you got all these different electrolyte ways. All of us are Quinton junkies. And, I always have those guys in Spain ready to give me vats of the shits so I could just dose some a little bit more potassium. I'll get that done next year. But, I mean, they're the best one-hit wonder. But, what do you do, Ben?
Ben: Quinton. I'd throw in some Protekt or some Element here and there just if I want a little bit of flavor if Quinton doesn't taste that great and I got a sweet tooth or something. But, I kind of like some of the flavor.
Chris: And, you get a little more potassium.
Ben: Yeah, yeah. And, I sprinkle salt on — I mean, you guys probably see me on meals here. I'm the guy with the giant box of salt. Literally, I have a little bit of food with my salt. But, I did a sweat sodium analysis, which is interesting. You can get a sweat sodium analysis done at any exercise fizz lab and you can actually find out the grams of sweat or the grams of sodium that you lose per hour during exercise. And, I had that test done and I'm four times higher than average for the amount of grams of sodium that I lose.
Chris: So, you're a salty guy.
Ben: I'm off the charts salty sweater because I used to go to bed after a long day of training. And, when I used to race Ironman, I could hear my blood pounding in my ears and it'd keep me awake at night and I just always thought I was training too much and I was sympathetically driven and just had to quiet my mind to get to sleep. And then, I did that sweat sodium analysis, I saw how much sodium I was losing and I started to just use copious amounts of salt. Again, like I'm doing here, just salt on everything and the electrolytes in almost every glass of water and a giant thing of the Adrenal Cocktail from Jigsaw Health in the morning. I do a couple scoops of that and some Quinton. And so, I'm salted up. My blood pressure is fantastic. So, that's not a worry. But, once I started doing that, all that pounding, everything just went away, the orthostatic hypertension, the vasovagal reflex like the dizziness sitting down, standing up, all that just went away.
Male: On to sleep, guys. Best recommendations for quality of sleep and recovery during your sleep.
Jason: My whole goal was how do I get the least amount of hours but get the highest percentages of REM and deep sleep with just enough light sleep to just make it through the next day but to have a really good quality sleep. Again, the minerals play a huge role for me, so I do the isotonic minerals at night. That has helped me tremendously.
What else? For me, again, liver-related, so doing some DEET like liver, like milk thistle, or I don't want this to be a freaking Quicksilver commercial, but I use liver sauce at night with the binders and then I do some of the minerals. For me, if I'm not sleeping well, it's a sympathetic/parasympathetic imbalance every time pretty much. So, anything I can do to get better balance in my nervous system before I go to bed.
Healthy sleep habits. Obviously, shutting screens and doing all the things you're supposed to do to wind down in the evening. But, for me, it's always autonomic nervous system balance going in.
Ben: Yeah, I agree. I mean, look, sleep hygiene is not difficult to decode. I mean, you hear it all the time. Dark room, quiet room, don't do business and stressful activities in bed and some silence or some type of ambient noise that assists with sleep. Those are the four biggies. And, people hear that, turn off the lights before they go to bed, and try to look at their phone for an hour before bed. But, you can really get into the weeds and get super specific with stuff. Like for the light, you get blasted with light in the first hour upon waking. That's when your sleep cycle starts. And so, that either means using the blue light boxes that they sell for seasonal affective disorder like the Re-Timer glasses or the Human Charger, you blast yourself with light but make sure that —
Chris: Oh, we don't just block blue light forever?
Ben: No, no. Blue light is good for you. You want a bunch of. Don't be the —
Chris: Blue in the morning, red at night.
Ben: Yeah. And, I mean, you can use anti-glare glasses if you work on the computer, but even those clear or yellow lens. And then, just total absence of light whenever the sun sets in whatever area of the world you happen to be in. But, I mean, you really got to geek out on it. We got red incandescent lights installed in our bedroom and I got a headlamp with a red-light hand lamp for getting around at night and in the morning. And, we got all the blue light blockers, and everything just dims down so the home is a cave with a fire in it at night. And so, you start to think about this stuff in a little more advanced way and it helps.
The temperature, same thing. You can lower the temperature in your home. But, a lot of people either don't get it cold enough, or else they're warm from a heavy meal or an exercise session like two to three hours before bedtime. So then, it comes down to things like lukewarm shower, wearing wool socks because you have these anastomosis veins in your feet that'll basically cool the rest of your body when you warm the feet. And, you can basically get the room temp very low, use breathable sheets. But, you start to think, okay, what are all the things I could do to stay cold because stuff stacked. Same thing with business in bed, I used to be the guy checking at a hotel and laptop goes in the bed, plop in my belly, do some work. I don't let my computer near the bed anymore. Even the books by the bedside aren't business books, they're fun books, or fiction books, or stuff that settles mine. And so, the bed is not for business.
And then, the last part, the noise part, I mean, gosh, Brain.fm makes a great little app that'll play ambient noise in the bedroom that lulls you to sleep like dreamscapes type of stuff. And, NuCalm has a great one. You have BrainTap uses light sound stimulation. So, it can come down to more than just calling up your neighbor and telling them to shut up their freaking dog. You can actually play certain sounds that'll really help lull you to sleep or help get you back to sleep if you wake up in the wee hours. And, you get more into supplementation, and GABA, and inhibitory neurotransmitters, and all things you'd take before bed from a supplementation standpoint. But, I think those four things: the light, the sound, the business, and the temperature are pretty important.
Chris: Yeah. I mean, the supplementation should only be when things are fucked up in your life. If all of a sudden you can't sleep and you have this autonomic balance, I mean maybe there's something short term but usually, there's some issue that you got to deal with. And, you're going to find out what the issues you've got to deal with it and then your supplement. You can use GABA. You can use CBD. You can use melatonin. Those are all going to help you get you there, but your checklist for when everything's good and you're trying to maximize it should be what he's talking about. So, recognize if something's going on. Because what that autonomic dysregulation — autonomic dysregulation can come from a lot of things. And, we think about stressors and stuff and I didn't resolve this with this person I keep waking up. But, where this leads back into detoxification is both infections and toxins can have the same threat response to your autonomic system. And, you can feel you're under threat and that's why detox stuff at night will help you. But, if you are just constantly waking up, there's some combination of things that you've got to deal with in your life and they're stressors, and some of them are interpersonal, and some of them are chemical, and some of them are immunological. And then, there's the don't do stupid shit and maximize as much as you can, all the stuff that Ben's talking about.
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Female: Well, actually, I had a question for all of you, but specifically Jason. You said that you like to take liver sauce before bed and then you also said that detox can help you before bed. For me, that's so interesting because I wake up in the morning and that's when I'll do liver sauce. I would never think about doing anything.
Chris: No, I'm glad you brought that up. Yeah. I mean, generally, we have people do early morning rounds because then you're fasted and so your AMPK and your NRF2 come up easily. Those fasting and carb restriction, you guys know all that for going to ketosis. That's all based on this trigger called AMPK. And, it and NRF2 are brothers, they sort of go brothers and sisters. And, they go up and down pretty well together. And so, fast, it is a good round for it and then usually around before dinner. But, we can do these things at night. I tend to not do something as powerful as PushCatch. It would be like brought milk thistle. Maybe sometimes you'll take liver sauce as long as there's not tons of stuff to move and stuff. Then, yeah, generally we like the AM thing. But, your milk thistle is one which doesn't bring you into having to then do binders and it's not such a investment.
Ben: One quick addition to that. If I have any struggle in the mornings, it would be constipation. And so, before bed, I have found that triphala, that three herb but it's ayurvedic blend, then we turn me onto it. I take triphala and magnesium and it works fantastically. I'm not super picky on them. I think I'm using the Mag Breakthrough right now with BiOptimizers and then about four of these little triphala capsules. And, yeah, it has a little bit of detoxification effect too because moving stuff through —
Chris: Yeah. triphala is fantastic actually. It's got the three parts: haritaki, bibhitaki, and amalaki. Amalaki is a super high vitamin C and polyphenol-1. They're all polyphenols, but that haritaki is the one we use heavily in mercury detox. In fact, this is a fun thing. Why did I put haritaki in a mercury detox thing? In ayurvedic alchemy, and this is really far out there, they use mercury as a healing thing. And, you have to purify it before you use it as a healing element by taking away all of its samskaras. All of its samskaras are accumulated habits, usually accumulated bad habits. So, mercury is a universal collector of bad habits. And so, to use it as a medicine, you first have to purify it of all of its bad habits. And then, when you take it, it sucks all of your bad habits in and you shit them out.
Now, what do they purify the mercury in before they do this but a bath of haritaki. So, it's the triphala thing.
Female: So, haritaki, it's an herb or what is it?
Chris: It's a nut. It's a fruit that comes off of these trees, the myrobalan tree. And, if you see the medicines buddha is sitting there with his glass of wine and his feet falling over. And, on one hand, on his left, he's holding this beautiful flower that's going up and the right, he's holding this bowl, the bowl of the long-life elixir. I think it's phospholipids and Quinton. But, the plant that's sprouting from his hands is the myrobalan. That's haritaki.
Female: Oh, wow. And, I had one last question, and that's which of your products are we talking about, which of your products has that ingredient in it?
Chris: Oh, Clear Way Cofactors is the only capsule that we make that has that. And, I've been working on a super purified liquid form of that. But, a lot of these basic polyphenols don't absorb well and they work through GI receptors. And so, Clear Way has a bunch of the stuff that's more GI-driven. And, the biggest thing in there is Haritaki.
Female: Thank you so much.
I have one more question personally, but I'm also happy to share you guys with the rest of the audience. So, I'll ask this real fast. So, I know all of you who worked with and probably currently work with pregnant and breastfeeding women, what are their options for detox realistically?
Male: Very gentle.
Female: Great question.
Chris: Yeah, really gentle. I mean, you've got binders, everything's in moderation at this point. So, liver flow is a problem that you run into during pregnancy, estrogen excess blocks off liver flow and hurts detox a little bit. So, really light bitters and phosphatidylcholine, especially phosphatidylcholine that's a building type of thing, light binders, all the exercise, sweating's all fine probably to a degree, and lots of good mineral balance and lots of water. It's all gentle. It's lovely. I mean, a lot of people get pregnant by accident and they got a mouthful of amalgams and they were planning to detox and they wanted to do all this stuff and then you give them a junior version of everything you would normally do, a lot more binding, no mobilizing just support liver and binding and hydration.
Jason: Yeah. It's not like you're not detoxifying throughout every day regardless of what phase you are in your life. So, pregnant or not, detox pathways or detox pathways, your liver, your intestines, your kidney, your skin, all of them need to work, all of them are hopefully working. So, I would be very comfortable doing things to improve and support organ function that way, improve sweating, improve kidney function, improve liver function, allow the body to just detoxify naturally that way. I just wouldn't push, yeah, all the heavy — yeah, it's just not the right time.
Chris: Yeah, stay away from those kale smoothies and lots of that —
Jason: No adrenal smoothies.
Ben: I see a lot of the reports that popped up over the past couple of years about tainted ayurvedic herbal supplements particularly related to metal toxicity and things like that and even a lot of liver issues and people use those protocols. So, all the more caution should be taken by pregnant breastfeeding women. When I've got a pregnant breastfeeding woman, particularly pregnancy who just wants to get a good movement protocol in, number one thing, I think, is underrated for pregnancy is swimming. I mean, just babies love that hydrostatic pressure and the swaying back and forth, it's great, it's low impact. As you get that relaxing built up in the joints, you have lower risk of injury, you get your cardiovascular performance still. And, I think swimming is just a fun-freaking-tastic obviously related detoxification. You want a good mineral pool not a chlorinated pool, but I think swimming is just amazing for pregnancy.
Female: Wait, that lends itself to a really important follow-up question, which is what's the perfect balance between like for us, we have a community pool. Of course, it's chlorinated, but it's so much fun, it's so much fun to bring our toddler. He loves it. He gets such good naps after. We all love it. I know that you occasionally swim in chlorinated pools. I'm very curious what your thoughts are on that.
Ben: It is interesting. I interviewed a guy actually, I forget his name, I think it was David Getoff maybe, about chlorination and chlorination detoxification. We did a whole podcast on it. It's on my website somewhere. And, I won't remember all the different things that he recommended, but there's a company, I think they're actually called Swim Spray and they make vitamin C-based spray that's literally designed to take chlorine. They've eliminated a lot of the transdermal absorption of chlorine. So, you get a good vitamin C spray and rub down afterwards because a lot a lot of the absorption is going to be transdermal. You're going to swallow a lot of that water. I'm not a fan of chlorine, but good rinsing and just cleaning up the body and using a vitamin C spray afterwards can still allow you to get by. We use a lot of minerals in our pool, a lot of hydrogen peroxide in our pool, and then we'll do a little bit of chlorine about once a week and not go in the pool on that day that we put it in.
Female: Yeah, cool. Thank you so much. And, do you have something to add?
Chris: We're talking amongst ourselves over here. Halogenation. And, what's the problem with chlorine? We're all like, “Oh, chlorine bad, but on one level, chlorine is a hormetic peroxide.” But, where it becomes very bad is it starts kicking out iodine out of iodination sites and the chlorine goes in there and blows out those, the iodine stuff. And so, it's not like, “Okay, I went to the pool, now I'm going to take my iodine.” It's just if you're a swimmer or shit, you're going to get long-term buildup and iodine's probably where it's going to screw things up the most.
Female: Oh, actually and I would love you to touch on lead because I hear that everywhere in all my mom groups, everyone's talking about lead and Caraway cookware and all sorts of things. I'm so curious.
Leland: Yeah. I mean, food's a big source, all the household chemicals, everybody wants to keep their house all clean and they spray 409 on the counter before the kid eats there and stuff. And so, just be really mindful about all the different toxins that you're exposed to.
Yeah, can you detoxify a kid if I had to do all kinds of detoxes on kids? Yeah. I mean, I don't think that we are going to write this down or you just do a little, little, little amount. So, what can you do sort of long-term there? So, in the whole concept of things pushing toxins out of cells then getting them out and binders and the GI, well, a lot of the binders are fibers and things like that and a lot of the green things. If you've had them tested real well, things like chlorella and spirulina a little bit in the drinks and smoothies, those access binders, you can put little bits of charcoal in. I mean, that really goes a long way. If you're worried about their exposure, you're like, “Oh, wait, this has been a problem.” And so, you can put little bits of these things into the drinks and have them take those down.
Occasionally, you'll get into bringing glutathione into kids, but it's usually when you're running into some problem. So, sort of the everyday is just basic health hygiene and just keeping everything clean. I mean, kids run themselves pretty easily. And, whenever you do detox them, just little bits go a long way. And, often homeopathics are all that you really need.
Jason: I think keeping their diet really strong and varied and that starts young. Again, that goes back to the resilience part. They're going to have toxins just like we all do. They're going to be exposed to things. So, keeping them as strong as they can be, getting them used to and exposed to healthier foods that are harder to introduce later on early as possible, I think that's critical. And, yeah, we've had to go through detoxing with kids. But, sometimes especially if we can look ahead of time and actually check a mom and/or a dad before the family even starts, that's huge to just overall protecting of the family. And so, anytime we have an opportunity to have those conversations really early. And, I think mom gets a lot of —
Jason: Credit, focus for the source of toxicity. But, for sure, I mean, it's equally contributing from male and female, especially on the whole epigenetic side.
Ben: And, one thing I'd throw in there is that my sons and I, we enjoy doing the sauna. We breathwork in the sauna, and a lot of times do the cold pool afterwards. Those are the four things we do for physical resilience. We do some kettlebells or something like that or calisthenics. And, we do the sauna and we do breathwork, and we do cold. The sauna and the breathwork, in particular, can really help with a lot of that lymphatic movement just a natural detoxification even for children. And, I've mentioned the sauna a couple of times, I'd be remiss not to mention that. You got three Greenfield stinky boys in their sauna sweating and there's toxins coming out your skin. So, if you do a lot of sweating in the sauna, you want to make sure that you regularly clean your sauna. I mean, we make sure we get ours a good rub down one to two times a week. So, just remember that the wood in the sauna, everything can absorb a lot of that stuff, and a lot of people don't think about that.
Male: [00:45:44] _____, Ben.
Ben: I don't know. That's my cleaner. Start clean sauna. Yeah.
Chris: Yeah. No, it's actually soap because the whole way soap works it goes into water and it creates these micelles that are fat on the middle and water-soluble on the outside, and all this stuff partitions into the soap and you wash it out. That's how you take the dirt, which is very fatty from the soil and that's how it comes off in the soap. And so, you do, but I mean all the Castiles and stuff are all you need. You don't need the 409 there.
I just grabbed the mic because I wanted to reiterate the importance of cleaning up before you have the kids. Klinghardt used to speak very eloquently and scarily about we need the mother to put out a lot of babies, and so the mother drops a lot of toxic load into the baby. And, it doesn't matter if you kill off the first one because there's a bunch of them coming along behind you. So, if it's your first kid, you really got to clean significantly. And, it's not that hard and we can put you through all kinds of detox scenarios, and then we don't have to worry about the kid.
Female: Yeah. Thank you for sharing that. I did a lot of water fasting before I got pregnant, but really I talked to you while I was pregnant and you were like, “Oh, you should have talked to me before,” I remember.
Male: The only answer really.
Female: Yeah. Well, thank you.
Well, the one thing I really was hoping someone would touch on if you guys know anything about this. Why am I saying so much about lead? And, especially with kids, I think it's maybe —
Chris: It's in the Gerber baby food.
Female: Oh, interesting. Well, I know the baby food with lead.
Chris: [00:47:23] _____ with us in the lead paint base. Our lead levels are ridiculous.
Female: Well, I think it's maybe in a lot of my circles people are moving into houses and buying old homes and renovating and buying antique furniture, and then it's like, “Oh, shoot.” At some point, they realize a lot of the stuff is toxic or has lead. So, I think it's just one of those things like even Caraway cookware, now people are saying that's not safe. Maybe this is a mom question.
Chris: Yeah, it is a mom question.
Female: Mom question.
Chris: And, lead, you can take kid, you can move mercury cadmium arsenic out of them no problem without too much intervention but lead is harder to move and you're coming in with EDTA, DMPS, stuff you don't really want to use. But fortunately, you can dilute out a kid with time. He gets a lot bigger and just stop all the load going in.
Female: Is there one more question to round this out or do you guys have anything you'd like to say before we close and have some drinks and apps?
Ben: We're having sushi tonight, right?
Female: No sushi. No. but, it's going to be delicious. We have sourdough, organic sourdough on the menu, both from Jessa, I think, and from the best organic sourdough we found in Austin. And then, I made the truffle porcini black garlic cheese that's on it. Actually, we made it. We made it in our cooking demos. So, glad that I'm getting to share —
Ben: Alright, this panel's over. It's over. It's over. Go, go, go, go.
Chris: No. There's one thing we didn't talk about at all and it's probably the most fundamental thing. We talked briefly about parasympathetic/sympathetic balance. But, what is sympathetic? Oh, it's fight or flight, right? What is parasympathetic? It's rest, digest, repair, regenerate, detoxify, the calming down, and opening up, and you have all the tools from the breathing to calming but don't start getting all sympathetic about using the tools. Oh, my god, I'm going to breathe and I'm going to upreg. I remember my friend, Naomi I was talking to her because she was toxic and she was talking about — I was like, “Well, you have to be in-person” and she's a CEO, I upregulate my parasympathetic all the time.
Male: Just like that.
Chris: Alright, can somebody point out the flaw here? And so, actually going in and relaxing, it was like CBD was a game-changer for doing detoxification in autistic kids because they're in a hypersympathetic thing all the time. That's neuroinflammation. And, the toxins bring us in there. Mercury is a specific activator of glutamate receptors which means it's going to get you hyperglutamate active, it's going to move you into that state that keeps all that stuff in. So, it's your job to move you into a calming state. And, we talked about hormones last night and estrogen what, it moves you into an anxious state because it works on glutamate receptors. And, progesterone moves you into calm state because it works on GABA receptors. So, if it's GABA, or CBD, or it's progesterone, it's slipping you into the calm. So, if you're doing rounds of detox or just long term, you have to be able to slip into the calm because when you're in the other, when it is fight or flight, then you have the toxic reactions you look at somebody. And, you're my source of toxins, you're my source of pain. All of this is my source of pain and you're holding on to all of it and you're misaligning it. It's Ben's freaking fault that I feel like this. All that is an error of the mind that propagates down. The bio flow actually stops when your glutamate dominant, it stops when you're sympathetic dominant because it's holding energy in because you're fighting or fleeing. And so, if you can't handle the neurological response, you can throw all the chemicals at it and it's not going to work. Often, all you need is a neurological response.
Ben: Hey, I've got a special announcement about an event that's taken place with me and my team at Ben Greenfield Life. So, we have our big Ben Greenfield Life team retreat this year in Sandpoint, Idaho. And, we're going to do what's called the Walk For Water during that event. We've partnered up with the fantastic charitable organization World Vision. And, on June 14th at about 10:00 a.m., we're going to be doing a 6K, 6K length event, which is the average distance people in the developing world have to walk to get water, sometimes sadly enough not even clean or safe water. But anyways, what we're going to do is we're going to raise money for World Vision to be able to provide clean water for someone in a developing country for life. And, World Vision does a fantastic job equipping farmers, equipping people who would normally not be able to get water with the ability to be able to produce water or get clean drinking water.
So, here's how you can help. There's a $50 donation option that will help to provide clean water. Fifty bucks is all it takes to provide clean water for one person for life. And, there's also a $50 registration fee where you too can join in to do the 6K. so, here's where you go, BenGreenfieldLife.com/WalkForWater. That's BenGreenfieldLife.com/WalkForWater. Check it out and get ready to join us on June 14th at 10:00 a.m. And, of course, you can just do this all virtually, you don't have to be in Sandpoint, Idaho for the event.
More than ever these days, people like you and me need a fresh entertaining, well-informed, and often outside-the-box approach to discovering the health, and happiness, and hope that we all crave. So, I hope I've been able to do that for you on this episode today. And, if you liked it or if you love what I'm up to, then please leave me a review on your preferred podcast listening channel wherever that might be and just find the Ben Greenfield Life episode. Say something nice. Thanks so much. It means a lot.
Earlier this month, I spent three days fully unplugged, and fully connected to an empowering, invigorating and pretty darn unique human experience.
This wellness event is called RUNGA, and attending this event regularly has been life-changing for me.
My days at RUNGA consisted of waking up in the morning to a delicious, nourishing organic breakfast, then spending the day partaking in activities like yoga and meditation, oxygen treatments, IVs, biohacking, cooking workshops, and much, much more.
With just fifty guests—a lively community of like-minded health-seekers—the secluded property at RUNGA is the ideal setting for an intimate gathering with human connection at its core. RUNGA is designed to uplift and rejuvenate, enhance cellular health, and empower the mind-body connection.
In the evenings at RUNGA, I enjoyed more fantastic food at special dinners (with organic wine from my favorite Dry Farm Wines) and listened to expert panels. I was fortunate to sit on a panel about detoxification with three of my former podcast guests:
- Dr. Leland Stillman (Light As Medicine, Metabolic Typing, COVID Controversies, Polar Bear Fitness, Healing Yourself With Laughter & More With Dr. Leland Stillman.)
- Dr. Chris Shade (The Latest Cool Longevity Drugs, The Best Way To Exercise For Your Mitochondria, Fasting For Men Vs. Women & Much More With Dr. Chris Shade.)
- Dr. Jason Sonners (A New Treatment For Blasting Tissues With Oxygen, Growing New Blood Vessels, Recovering Faster, Killing Bacteria, Building Stem Cells & Much More!).
During the panel, we had a fantastic chat about everything detoxification, including proper sauna use, how to optimize sleep for detoxification, detoxification strategies for pregnant women and children, and plenty more. Enjoy the chat!
(Also, you can apply here for the next RUNGA event that will be held in October in Austin, Texas. If your experience is anything like mine, you'll walk away feeling ten years younger in three days.)
In this special episode, you'll discover:
-The panelists' views on detoxification…05:30
- High mercury levels are likely culprits for health problems
- High zinc levels due to a job; zinc supplements add to the problem
- Nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, headaches are some signs of zinc toxicity
- How often are you pooping; get binders from Dr. Shade (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Proper balance with sauna use
- Micronutrients, vitamins, minerals
- Lifestyle practices; how you live your days is how you live your life
- Jump up and down on a trampoline
- Infrared sauna
- Coffee enema once per week
- Toxicity vs. sufficiency
- Toxins are in the environment
- Increase resilience in the body to toxins
-Subtle symptoms of an over-toxified person…16:45
- Glutamate excess and sympathetic overdrive
- Mitochondria at the cellular level
- Infrared sauna
- Mini trampoline throughout the day
- Vibrating platform for lymphatic flow
-The best way to re-mineralize the body…20:53
- Quinton (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Sweat sodium analysis
- Adrenal cocktail by Jigsaw Health
-Recommendations for quality sleep and recovery while you sleep…23:05
- Isotonic minerals (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Quicksilver Milk Thistle (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Quicksilver Liver Sauce (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Quicksilver Binder (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Healthy sleep habits
- Autonomic nervous system balance
- Blast with light when you wake up (blue light)
- Re-Timer glasses
- Anti-glare glasses
- Red incandescent lights in the bedroom
- Lower temp in the home while sleeping
- Cold shower before bed
- Wear socks while sleeping
- No business in the bedroom
- GABA, CBD, melatonin to supplement, not as a crutch
- Personal, chemical, immunological stressors
-Liver Sauce to detox…32:45
- AMPK and NRF2 are similar
- Quicksilver Milk Thistle (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Magnesium Breakthrough (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Clear Way Cofactor by Quicksilver with Haritake (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
-Detox options for pregnant and breastfeeding women…37:00
- Everything in moderation
- Estrogen excess blocks liver flow
- Light bitters, binders, sweating
- Improve organ function; allow body to detoxify naturally
- Swimming is great for mom and baby
-Thoughts on swimming in chlorinated pools…40:00
- Podcast on chlorination with Dr. David Getoff:
- Vitamin C based spray to neutralize chlorine
- Levels of chlorine aren't as bad as others
-Detox strategies for children…41:45
- Foods, household chemicals
- Spirulina and Chlorella
- Exposure to healthier foods at a young age
- Sweating in the sauna (clean regularly)
- Mother drops lots of toxins into the baby, especially the first one
- Rest, digest, repair, regenerate, detoxify/fight or flight
-And much more…
- Health Optimization Summit! Use code BEN for 20% off (May 22-29, 2022).
- Walk For Water on June 14.
- Keep up on Ben's LIVE appearances by following bengreenfieldlife.com/calendar
Resources mentioned in this episode:
- Podcast on chlorination with Dr. David Getoff:
– Other Resources:
- Infrared Sauna
- Power Plate Vibration Platform
- Re-Timer Glasses
- Red Incandescent Bulbs
- Activated Charcoal
- Quinton Hypertonic (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Adrenal cocktail By Jigsaw Health
- Quinton Isotonic (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Quicksilver milk thistle (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Quicksilver Liver Sauce (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Quicksilver Binder (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Quicksilver Milk Thistle (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Magnesium Breakthrough (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Clear Way Cofactor by Quicksilver (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Quicksilver Bitters (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Quicksilver Binder (use code GREENFIELD10 to save 10%)
- Energy Bits Spirulina
- Recovery Bits Chlorella
–Therabody: Take control of your recovery with Therabody and relax with Therabody’s 30-day money-back guarantee. (02:28)
–Lucy Nicotine Gum: If you are looking for a cleaner and tastier alternative to other nicotine products, then this product is for you. The gum comes in three flavors – Wintergreen, Cinnamon, and Pomegranate – and the lozenges in cherry ice. To save 20% on any order, just use discount code BEN20. (03:40)
–Organifi Red Juice: Enjoy all the benefits of the 11 superfoods and their micronutrients that help increase resting metabolism, support cardiovascular health, and remove toxins to turn back the hands of time! Receive a 20% discount on your entire order when you use discount code BENG20. (28:45)
–Nootopia: experience your best mood and mental performance with personalized Nootropics. Enter code BEN10 for a 10% discount. (29:56)
–Ice Barrel: With its sleek design and compact footprint, Ice Barrel, allows you to experience the benefits of cold therapy from the convenience of your home. (31:45)