February 1, 2024

Envision the oppressive pursuit of physical perfection — enduring rigorous training on a mere 800-calorie daily diet. You might look like Adonis on the outside, but on the inside, you have the testosterone levels of a 90-year-old.

My guest today, Jason Phillips, not only broke free from the clutches of this demanding reality but reshaped it into a narrative of resilience. Beyond reclaiming his health and vitality, he transformed his journey into a guiding compass for others aspiring to optimize their well-being and achieve better health, fitness, and longevity goals.

Jason, a veteran in the fitness industry for decades, transitioned from a former cover model and professional athlete to becoming a highly sought-after fitness and nutrition coach. Currently serving as the CEO and founder of the Nutritional Coaching Institute, Jason's influence extends through various avenues.

At the core of his impactful work is a successful mentorship program for fitness and nutritional professionals. Here, Jason offers both group and individualized coaching to some of the most talented people in the industry, nurturing their growth and expertise.

Not just limited to coaching, Jason has contributed to publications like Men’s Journal and authored books that have become staples in the field, including Macros Explained: Your Ultimate Guide to Macronutrient Prescription for Health, Performance, and Aesthetics and his newest book, Macros Applied: Bridging the Gap from Science to Application.

Jason is a popular and prolific podcast guest featured in over 50 podcasts such as Renegade Radio with Jay Ferruggia, Ever Forward Radio with Chase Chewning, Mind Pump: Raw Fitness Truth, and Barbell Shrugged.

Jason routinely speaks at Google, has been interviewed by Entrepreneur Weekly, and has been the featured speaker at the Cascade Classic and the 2018 Fitness Business Summit.

During this discussion, you'll discover:

-Jason Phillips…05:34

• A cover model and a professional athlete
• A sought-after fitness and nutrition coach
• The CEO and the founder of the Nutritional Coaching Institute (NCI Special Offer – 78% off their Exclusive Level 1 Certification Bundle)
• Macros Explained
• Macros Applied

-CrossFit community and paleo diet…06:53

• Jason was the first one to educate the CrossFit community on the importance of post-workout supplements
• Paleo was the predominant diet in the CrossFit community
• Podcast with the MindPump guys:
  • “The Mysterious Micro-Workouts, Turning On Your Butt, Overdosing With Melatonin & More With The MindPump Guys”
• Jason pointed out that the level of carbohydrate intake on the paleo diet is shockingly low
• Worked with competitive CrossFitters
• At the time, their daily carbohydrate intake was not enough for recovery after training
  • The big issue was adrenal fatigue
  • The cortisol response of high-intensity workouts was not addressed in any way
• Dr. Jeff Volek’s FASTER study over at UConn's Human Performance Laboratory
  • A group of athletes followed about an 85% to 90%, fat-based ketogenic, very low-carb diet
  • 50 to 60 grams of carbohydrates per day for a year
  • Extensive tests were performed
• The result:
  • For long-term aerobic activity, you can almost double what textbooks have said that you could burn in terms of fat grams per minute
  • Not necessarily have a faster aerobic time or better aerobic performance
• The rating of perceived exertion on the V̇O₂ max test was higher in the low-carb athletes
• Thyroid dysregulation, decreased testosterone and libido, increased recovery time

-Possible reasons for feeling better on a paleo diet…16:49

• A classic 80/20 polarized approach
• Ketone esters
• The reason for feeling better after restricting carbs
  • Gluten intolerance
  • FODMAP
  • GMOs, pesticides, or herbicides sensitivity
  • Fructose intolerance
• You can control the amount of that stimulus relative to your recovery abilities
• The majority of athletes just weren't fueling relative to what they truly needed

-Carnivore vs. paleo diet…20:25

• How does the carnivore community get their carbohydrates?
• Paul Saladino is now eating fruits and honey
• Podcast with Paul Saladino:
  • “Carnivore Diet Myths Debunked, Hard Questions About Meat Vs. Plants, Are Broccoli Sprouts Really Bad For You & Much More With Dr. Paul Saladino.”
• Introducing fruit and getting closer to the paleo diet
• A type of paleo diet is a reasonable foundation for the majority of people to eat
• It's not ever going to fuel high-level athletics
• A paleo diet is largely driven by an interest in controlling autoimmunity
  • Ben’s wife experienced better skin with the paleo diet
• The autoimmune paleo diet (AIP) is amazing for assisting with autoimmunity
• The Dietary Cure for Acne by Loren Cordain
• Nutritional Coaching Institute
• Being cut and lean and having 12-pack abs all year long is not synonymous with longevity
  • It’s a stressor — the way to live a long time is to reduce your stressors
  • A reduction in body fat is only stimulated by creating a calorie deficit

-Jason’s struggle with anorexia…27:16

• Graduated high school and thought he was going to play golf for a living
• Got injured and was approached by a modeling recruiter from Abercrombie and Fitch
• He was required to have abs
  • Trained hard every day and drastically lowered his calorie intake to 800 calories a day
• Anorexia issues and suicidal thoughts
  • Hormonal decline and extreme tiredness
  • Couldn’t keep a job
• Started working at Gold's Gym
• Met a trainer who advised him to eat 4,000 calories a day
  • Gained 10–12 pounds 3 weeks later and realized he wasn’t fat
• Did a blood test and had the testosterone of a 90-year-old
  • Increased calories and went on testosterone
• Got certified as a trainer and obtained a degree in health and fitness

-Testosterone replacements…37:51

• At first, he was declined for testosterone
• His blood tests showed a very low level of testosterone
• He has been on testosterone replacement for almost 20 years
• For the last 3 years, he has been using HCG (human chorionic gonadotropin) and feels better
• Herbal strategies for testosterone deficiency
  • Turkesterone and Tribulus
  • Upregulates the central nervous system, provides energy, and increases libido
• It's an effect on lifestyle that results in a positive feedback loop for endogenous production
• Jason lacks faith in the majority of supplements unless supported by peer-reviewed studies

-Who to follow for nutritional advice…44:17

• The only people who can provide any sort of meal planning are registered dieticians
• In 2012, it was very common for coaches to send you a meal plan, and that was illegal
• A coach can only provide advice based on their experience
• Nutritional Coaching Institute
• Most coaches in this space today aren't providing meal plans
• You have to be very careful that you're not in any way creating prescriptive measures if you are not a registered dietician

-What NCI offers…48:33

• Nutritional Coaching Institute teaches people how to apply science in real-world scenarios
  • Bridging the gap from science to application in the nutritional space
  • Real-life examples of their work
  • Navigating client’s goals
  • NCI Special Offer – 78% off their Exclusive Level 1 Certification Bundle
• 50% of the people that come to NCI are already in the fitness industry, to some degree
• The other 50% want a career change
• How much money do nutrition coaches make?

-Building a business in the health and fitness industry…54:19

• Many people in the industry don’t know how to market themselves
• Do people in NCI learn how to become more visible?
• The biggest problem in the industry:
  • People see the financial opportunity, but they're not well-equipped enough to create the change 
  • Coaches who treat everybody else like they treat themselves and assume it is going to work
• The most important skill is the ability to create a change
• Also, you have to know how to find clients and how to run a business
• Ben created a massive amount of content to establish expert status in the industry
• Jason thinks AI is not going to disrupt anything for the next three years
• Lane Norton
• The importance of branding and marketing
• Ben's book Boundless is being revised
• AI is weak in telling a compelling personal story
  • An article needs to have a level of entertainment value and a personal story to hook readers
  • Recitation of facts for 90 minutes doesn’t hold anybody's attention
• Tom Bilyeu thinks that emotional quotient (EQ) can be intelligently understood algorithmically
• Podcast with Tom Bilyeu:
  • “Cyclic Ketosis, ‘Thinkitating,' Bad-Ass Meditation, Morning Routines & More With Quest Nutrition Founder Tom Bilyeu”
• Humans desire connection with another person
• People in the AI world will figure out how to weave stories in

-Using AI to create meal plans…1:05:03

• Creating a meal plan as a collaborative effort
• Parameters of advice and very specific questions are essential for the creation of a meal plan
• This can be done with AI; however, clients like the opportunity to ask questions and make their coaches proud

-Jason’s most important routine…1:08:32

• Jason doesn’t get much into supplementation
• Spends the majority of his time on business development
• Trains three to four times a week
  • Primarily full-body workouts
  • More geared around golf-specific work
• Ben’s recommendation — full-body strength three times a week
• Jason is very intuitive, not very numerical
• He is in tune with how he’s feeling from a recovery and an energy standpoint
• Most of his calories come from dinner
  • The social aspect of a dinner
• The awareness of your mortality
• The realization that your children will leave your home