How To Become A Billionaire, The Brilliance Of “The Flywheel,” The Future Of Self-Quantification & Anti-Aging & Much More With Naveen Jain.

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Anti-aging, Biohacking, Body, Digestion, Lifestyle, Longevity & Age Reversal, Mind-Spirit, Nutrition, Podcast, Podcast-new, Purpose

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Naveen Jain is an entrepreneur and philanthropist who is driven to solve the world's biggest challenges through innovation. A man who knows no limits, Naveen pushes big dreams into action—spurring massive cultural and technological change. His audacious vision and magnetic personality continually inspires others to follow what feels impossible.

The founder of Moon Express, World Innovation Institute, iNome, TalentWise, Intelius, and Infospace, Naveen sees beyond the current business and technological landscape, creating companies that make a true impact.

Ernst and Young's Entrepreneur of the Year, Silicon India's “Most Admired Serial Entrepreneur,” and the receiver of the “Albert Einstein Technology Medal” for his pioneers in technology, Naveen has been repeatedly honored for his entrepreneurial successes. Red Herring also recognized him as one of the “Top 20 Serial Entrepreneurs” and with the “Lifetime Achievement Award.”

Naveen Jain's next endeavor is to travel to the moon, using lunar resources for innovation here on earth.

Whether it's business or life, Naveen is guided by one firm belief – our only limit is our imagination.

In my first episode with Naveen, “Age Reversing Via The Gut, The Ultimate Anti-Anxiety Pill, Customized Probiotics & More With Billionaire Entrepreneur & Viome Founder Naveen Jain.”, we discussed:

  • Why Naveen thinks most microbiome evaluations are complete snake oil…
  • How Naveen licensed $21 million gut sequencing technology from Los Alamos laboratory…
  • Naveen's shocking prediction about the next big thing in health care…
  • And much more…

Then, in my second episode with Naveen, Poop, Bacteria & You: The Latest Cutting-Edge Science Of The Human Microbiome (& How To Affordably Test Your Own Gut)., we discussed:

  • Whether or not human microbiomes “evolve” with changing technology and civilization trends such as the industrial revolution…
  • How Viome can use a single stool sample to determine the overall health of your gut…
  • How you know whether the disease is causing the microbiome to be deleteriously affected, or whether a poor microbiome is causing the disease…
  • And much more…

(You may also be interested in watching or hearing Dr. Ally Perlina, Viome's chief science officer, go over the results of my own microbiome analysis.)

In this podcast, Naveen travels to my home in Spokane, Washington and we chat about the latest in longevity, life, and the latest innovations in fitness, mental health, and immunity—plus the latest on mitochondria, biological aging, and cellular health.

During this discussion, you'll discover:

-Naveen's observations of Ben's daily life in Spokane, WA…6:35

  • Dedication to family
  • Positive outlook on life
  • Role model to many, but also to the boys and wife
  • Love for nature and for God
  • Lightbulb moment – “You're not raising your children, you're raising your grandchildren”
  • Establishing traditions that will last for generations

-The proper role of the elderly in society…12:20

  • Important to pass the wisdom from the elderly on to our children and grandchildren
  • You're a pariah in Eastern culture if you dishonor your parents or grandparents
  • BGF podcast with Marisa Peer
  • Book: You Can be Younger by Marisa Peer
  • Post-menopausal women live longer when given a matriarchal role
  • We're all connected in a larger ecosystem
  • The “love bucket” is never-ending

-The big questions that propel Naveen's quest for knowledge…19:30

  • “Why me?” and “Why now?”
  • We are not genetically predisposed to chronic disease
  • Excessive focus on genetics (genes don't change, the expression does)
  • Digitizing the human body: chemical signals transmitted through the brain and body
  • Change biochemical activity via diet and lifestyle to attain desired objective
    • What if? – The key to starting anything in life; Do not worry about the “How?”
  • Too much faith in testing; we all have different genes
  • Personalization and precision in testing genes, the microbiome, etc.
  • Tech is more accessible and affordable than ever before
  • AI can interpret data that wasn't possible even 10 years ago
  • “What is it I believe that most people disagree on?”
  • Not the right answer, but the right question

-How the gut microbiome affects the chemical signaling in our bodies…34:00

  • Over 40 trillion cells in our body, generating chemicals we ignore while focused on DNA and genes
  • “Micro poops” signal to the human body what to do
  • 90% of serotonin produced in the gut (by your own epithelial cells, waiting on signaling from the bacteria in your body)
  • Worry more about what organisms in your gut are doing, rather than what organisms are in the gut
  • More diversity of microorganisms in the mouth than in the gut (less than 1% in quantity but diversity is higher)
  • Benefits of chewing food adequately and in a relaxed state
    • Sends signals to the gut on what's to come
    • Symmetrical issues if not adequate, or food too soft
  • Alzheimer's may be traced to leaky gut syndrome
  • Clean the mouth, not merely brush the teeth
  • BGF podcast with Dr. Dominic Nischwitz
  • Ben's oil pulling mouthwash kills opportunistic bateria: pour ingredients into a mold and put into refrigerator;
  • Oil pulling recipe:
  • Copper tongue scraper
  • Ayurvedic flossing tools using neem tree twigs 

-The foundation of an integrative understanding of the gut…44:45

  • Gut-brain, gut-liver, gut-mouth axis
  • Viome Gut Intelligence Test (use code GREENFIELD to save $10)
  • Health Intelligence (understand how the human cells are impacted by the gut)
  • Blood tests are scalable and affordable; goal is to make cellular tests the same
  • Viome Health Intelligence Test
    • Look at every gene expression in the blood
    • RNA test
  • Fasted exercise induces AMP-K (cellular stress)
    • AMP-K significantly increases PGC1-α, the master regulator for mitochondrial biogenesis
  • Metformin, berberine, etc. induce xenohormetic stress (exercise in a bottle)
  • Cellular senescence results in excess aging and inflammation
    • Consumption of NAD, NMN, NR, etc. exacerbates cellular senescence
    • Senescent cells, in youth, can assist in anabolism (pro-growth); as these accumulate with age, can result in excess aging and increased risk of chronic disease and inflammation
  • Docs who administer NAD utilize anti-senescent cell compounds

-A method of testing that is truly personalized to the individual…56:15

  • Testing multiple pathways leads to more educated decisions on nutrients, supplements, etc.; quantity of said compounds
  • Health Intelligence does 2 things: gut microbiome test and blood test combined
  • To be launched soon: Whole-body Intelligence – saliva, stool, blood
  • True personalization vs. categorization
    • Demographics (gender, race, etc. are categories)
    • Look at an individual at the molecular level
    • Precision supplements, nutrients, etc.
  • A solution made to order for each individual based on molecular testing
  • AI and robotics drive production costs down
  • Whole foods vs. supplementation:
    • Supplements are not an alternative to whole foods
    • Eat the right food, avoid the bad food; supplement to fill in the gaps
  • Health Intelligence tells you what foods to eat and why; what foods to avoid and why; and then the additional nutrients
  • Precision supplements – One nutrient found in a food may be given, but not the entire food; some other nutrient in the food may not be good for an individual (You have to eat ≈20lbs of blueberries to get the same amount of nutrients you get from a 12mg capsule)

-The “flywheel” concept in running a business…1:03:20

  • Product constantly changing and evolving
  • The value always increasing with each client or product sold
  • Every person part of the ecosystem making everyone else better, before and in the future
  • “How am I making this customer a better person with each transaction?”
  • Technology itself cannot solve the problem of learning
  • Collecting data, customizing the experience, use AI to constantly improve the experience
  • “Moonshot thinking” (why now, why me?) – outside the box thinking
  • Tim Ferris: “What could go wrong with this decision?”
  • Create scenarios that seem silly; may lead to a viable solution
  • Create a team to do the things you can't do, or don't know
  • Never ask, “Is this possible?” Say, “Make this possible…”
  • An entrepreneur is someone who solves a problem, not necessarily a business owner, CEO, etc.

-The case for space exploration in the midst of a slew of problems here on Earth…1:16:30

  • Scarcity mindset: If I do this, I can't do that. Should be: If I can do this, I can also do that
  • Planet Earth is a spacecraft; alternate home if it gets damaged
  • The planet will be fine; worry about the human species
  • Ben's essay: “Our Father's World

-Recommended resources to think like a billionaire…1:20:40

-The most remarkable thing Naveen has done for his health in the past year…1:32:00

  • Changed diet significantly (there's no such thing as a healthy or worst food; it all depends on the individual)
    • Sometimes, nutrients in food are not enough so supplementing is required
  • Do something interesting every day:
    • Gratitude journaling and feeling that you are learning new things everyday
    • Am I intellectually better today than yesterday? Am I emotionally better today than yesterday? Am I spiritually better today than yesterday?
    • The day you stop growing, the day you stop learning, is the day you actually die
    • Why not? What if? Why can't it be done? Imagine!
  • Live the life!
  • Ben's re-write of the Christian Gratitude Journal, The Spiritual Disciplines Journal, involves 4 different practices
    • In the morning:
      • What you are grateful for?
      • Write down one person you can help or serve that day
    • In the evening:
      • Self-examination – What good have I done this day? What could I have done better this day?
      • How did I best live out my life's purpose this day?
    • The journal encompasses multiple variants of Spiritual Disciplines practices
      • Gratitude
      • Service
      • Self-examination
      • Purpose

-And much more!

Click here for the full written transcript of this podcast episode.

Resources from this episode:

Naveen Jain:

– BGF podcasts:

– Book: You Can be Younger by Marisa Peer

– Other resources:

Episode sponsors:

Kion Colostrum: Nature’s “first food” that supports immunity, GI function, athletic recovery, and more. BGF listeners, receive a 10% discount off your entire order at Kion when you use discount code BEN10.

Joovv: After using the Joovv for close to 2 years, it's the only light therapy device I'd ever recommend. Give it a try: you won't be disappointed. Order your Joovv today and receive my brand new book, Boundless as a free gift.

Thrive Market: Organic brands you love, for less. Your favorite organic food and products. Fast and free shipping to your doorstep. Receive a gift card worth up to $20 when you begin a new membership.

Butcher Box: Delivers healthy 100% grass-fed and finished beef, free-range organic chicken, and heritage breed pork directly to your door on a monthly basis. All their products are humanely raised and NEVER given antibiotics or hormones. 

Do you have questions, thoughts, or feedback for Naveen or me? Leave your comments below and one of us will reply!

Ask Ben a Podcast Question

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33 thoughts on “How To Become A Billionaire, The Brilliance Of “The Flywheel,” The Future Of Self-Quantification & Anti-Aging & Much More With Naveen Jain.

  1. Mary says:

    Just cancelled everything I had going with Viome. It has been the worst experience I have had in a very long time. Sure seems like a money making scheme to me. A lot of trickery going on and impossible customer serve department. I would never recommend them.

  2. ferran says:

    Naveen. comes to the podcast every time has a product to sell. This is an infomercial dress as a podcast.
    Naveen has a bad reputation from previous companies, both Infospace and Intelius I would be careful.

  3. Tracey says:

    You say, “Cellular senescence results in excess aging and inflammation and that consumption of NAD, NMN, NR, etc. exacerbates cellular senescence … Senescent cells, in youth, can assist in anabolism (pro-growth); as these accumulate with age, can result in excess aging and increased risk of chronic disease and inflammation”

    Yet David Sinclair who is all about longevity research at Harvard promotes the consumption of NAD, NMN and NR???

    This is very conflicting and confusing. Can you point me to some research that explains your opinion further?

  4. Tracey says:

    You mentioned not to take Quercetin with Vitamin C but didn’t say why?
    The Eastern Virginia Medical School is using this cocktail for their Covid patients:
    *Vitamin C 500 mg BID and Quercetin 250-500 mg BID
    • Zinc 75-100 mg/day (acetate, gluconate or picolinate). Zinc lozenges are preferred. After 1-2
    months, reduce the dose to 30-50 mg/day.
    • Melatonin (slow release): Begin with 0.3mg and increase as tolerated to 1-2 mg at night
    • Vitamin D3 1000-4000 u/day (optimal dose unknown).

  5. Tracey says:

    Do the gut tests only return information on what you are currently eating? For example, if you are eating a carnivore diet there wouldn’t be any carbs in your gut to sample and if you were a vegan, there wouldn’t be any animal protein in there. Does your current diet affect the outcome of the test?

  6. Carl Schenkenberger says:


    you teased posting a video of Ben singing to his boys at bedtime. Was that posted? If so, could you link it here? If not, could you post it, please?


    1. Shadow says:

      I’m looking for the same… no sign of it…

      1. I just added it to the shownotes. You can watch it here:…

  7. John Groberg says:

    Great podcast! I share the vision of transforming our sick-care system into true healthcare through precision, preventative and predictive applications that are being made possible by new scientific understanding and technology. The government can’t do it, and the insurance system can’t do it, but technology + entrepreneurship will! It’s exciting to begin to see real-world, direct-to-consumer applications like Viome starting to show up and lead the way.

    Another I’m excited to see hit the market soon is Vessel. Theirs is pee on a card and then scan a QR code and get instant reports. I’ve also tried Baze (personalized supplements packs based on blood test mail in kits), and hair analysis. More cool stuff coming soon- including from Viome. I did the Viome Gut Intelligence test about 9 months ago and found the report I got from it very interesting and useful in helping me make food choices. I would also like to see some reporting on overall gut biome alpha and beta diversity, and % of key organisms like Akkermansia, Biffidobacterium and even some of the “bad players” like e-coli, etc. Maybe that’s coming in a future version? I’m also interested in trying the more comprehensive Health Intelligence test next. Maybe Naveen should give Ben Greenfield listeners a special discount?

    But even more than the precision health discussion, as a business owner, I really enjoyed many of the things Naveen shared about asking the right questions and thinking about how to build a flywheel business. I made many notes and have been thinking a lot about how to apply these things to my business. I’m a member of Peter Diamandis’ Abundance Digital community. Naveen was just recently featured by Peter on a video interview in that community, so it was nice to hear from Naveen twice in one week. I love the positive, abundance mindset that permeates that community and that Naveen embodies so well. My MTP (which Naveen will know stands for Massively Transformative Purpose) is to “help illuminate the black boxes of body and ego” Viome is one of the services that is helping to do this. I’m excited to do my part to help build a future where both the black boxes of body and ego become more and more illuminated- leading to people embodying more and more of their infinite potential. I believe this will best be done with a combination of direct-to-consumer, AI-supported, data-driven services like Viome and others, but also with the direct doctor-to-patient guidance of integrative doctors that can help direct, interpret and help implement and support changes each individual needs to make to their diet, lifestyle, and mindset. That’s part of what my vision is for my business.

    I see both of you as doing an amazing amount of work toward this same goal and am inspired by your examples. Thank you!

  8. John says:

    Great podcast! I’ve been interested in Viome for awhile now for myself but mostly for my 5 year old daughter. She suffers from many food allergies and chronic eczema. The eczema has gotten so bad we have resorted to using small doses of immunosuppressants to help tame her reactions. She is allergic to dairy, eggs, nuts mostly. Was hoping Viome could give us some insight into her gut bacteria needs, while also being sensitive to her food allergies? Thanks!

  9. Daniel says:

    Naveen’s energy and excitement is infectious but the amount of interruptions made that hard to listen to at times.

  10. Ana says:


    Great podcast. When taking these tests, does the cost include the supplements?, and if so, for how long. Are these 2 different tests?, or are they done simultaneously? ( gut and health intelligence)

    Thanks , Ana

    1. Viome Team says:

      Hey Ana,
      Viome Precision Supplements are an add-on product to our Health Intelligence or Gut Intelligence Tests for 149USD/mo for 12 months. We do have two different testing options, our standalone Gut Intelligence Test that looks at the active microbes, as well as how they are functioning inside of your gut. Viome’s Health Intelligence Test (which includes our Gut Intelligence Test) looks at your gene expression and provides additional insight on your cellular and mitochondrial health. For our Health Intelligence Test, you must send in both tests to our lab for analysis simultaneously. Hope this helps clarify some things.

      You can read more about Viome’s services here:

      All the best,
      Viome Team

  11. Tarvo says:

    Thank you both for another interesting podcast. I loved the flywheel example for businesses between all the good you provided…

    I have been waiting until Viome started delivering to Estonia but so far we aren’t on the list, there are a few European countries listed but the current situation doesn’t really promote travelling. Just mentioning…

  12. Naveen,

    What a great podcast!

    As a lifetime vegetarian, and mostly vegan, is there anything that I should be mindful of when it comes to nutrients?

    I look forward to trying Viome soon!

    1. Viome says:

      Thank you for your interest in Viome! One of the most important factors to consider when thinking about the nutrients your body needs, is how efficiently your body is currently breaking down and utilizing the micro & macro nutrients through the food you eat. Viome Precision Supplements and Health Intelligence test are designed to provide you with the comprehensive knowledge and address what nutrients your body may be breaking down inefficiently or lacking. Visit our website and learn more about how Viome’s analysis takes the guesswork out of health at!

  13. Jonathan Horrrer says:

    Dear Ben and Naveen,

    Thank you for this powerfull podcast!

    As a Sport Scientist and future functional health practicioner I just started a small company with my friend.

    This podcast was so inspiring for me and motivated me to keep learning and seeking for solutions.

    Greeting from Germany and thank you again,


    1. Naveen Jain says:

      Thank you Jonathan for your kind words. I wish you the best in your adventures and I hope your inspiration leads you to help millions of people live healthier lives.

  14. Jane says:

    What a joke. Naveen Jain is an obvious scam artist. But he is real good at blowing smoke up your ass.

    1. Naveen Jain says:

      Thank you Jane, We love you too. I will pray for you and hope you find peace and love in your soul to love yourself so you can see good in others. You end up hating everyone when you hate yourself.

    2. Steven says:

      That maybe but I love his thought process. The determination to figure something out when it’s going against the norm

  15. Ged says:

    Great podcast guys!

    Naveen, when will Health Intelligence be available in Australia and also when can we expect Whole-body Intelligence test?

    Thank you!

    1. Naveen Jain says:


      We expect to launch the Health Intelligence test in Australia in the next 30-45 days. Whole Body Intelligence won’t be out until the new year.

      1. Ged says:

        Thank you, Naveen!
        Looking forward to trying the test!


      2. Daniel says:

        What is the current situation in regards to shipment of the the samples? Is it arriving in time in the US? Would your team (or any users here) have an idea of the average shipping and customs costs from Australia?

        Thanks for the podcast, very interesting discussions.

  16. Neil says:

    Hi Naveen and Ben so good to hear your thoughts and ideas. I would be very interested in taking the Health Intelligence Test, but am put off by the high price. You spoke about commoditising health and falling prices, so I wonder if the price of this test is likely to go lower at some point? Thank you again, Neil

    1. Naveen Jain says:

      Neil, we sell all of our tests close to our actual cost. I think it will likely be $50 cheaper in few weeks to celebrate the launch of our precision supplements.

  17. Hi,

    Based on NR or NMN impact on senescent cells do you recommend older folks (75 plus) not take it? I just switched form NR to NMN.



    1. Naveen Jain says:

      There is no such thing as universal healthy food or universal healthy nutritional ingredient (supplement). You have to take all the molecular data into account before popping any pill or swallowing any food. This is where Viome Health Intelligence ( can help you get insights into your body’s functioning and get food and supplements that are designed just for you.

  18. Todd Krider says:

    Thanks guys! Great listen…

  19. Gary Keene says:

    Good morning, Ben 👋

    You would enjoy listening to Michael Pollan’s brief audio book titled “CAFFEINE.”😳

    Note that Mr. Pollan wrote about his (and the world’s) relationship to caffeine as an “Audible original” and can only be accessed through that service.

    No doubt his experience will resonate with your own.😉

  20. Roberta says:

    Thanks for the stimulating Podast!

    1. Naveen Jain says:

      Thank you for your kind words

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