[Transcript] – A Done-For-You “Shotgun” Formula For Fixing Your Digestion (The Gut Repair Formula), Oral Peptides, Mold & More With LVLUP Health’s Kyal Van Der Leest.

Affiliate Disclosure


From podcast: https://bengreenfieldlife.com/podcast/lvlup/

[00:00:00] Introduction

[00:01:01] Podcast Sponsors

[00:05:49] Introduction

[00:11:54] Getting into supplements and biochemistry

[00:16:48] Gut health, mold, and parasites

[00:27:42] Podcast Sponsors

[00:32:12] cont. Gut health, mold, and parasites

[00:34:05] Leaky Guts

[00:38:30] Gut Repair Formula — Ingredients

[01:05:46] The best way to use the product

[01:07:36] Closing the Podcast

[01:09:29] HUM2N Event

[01:11:37] Podcast Sponsors

Ben:  My name is Ben Greenfield. And, on this episode of the Ben Greenfield Life podcast.

Kyal:  When taking peptides early, buffering the pepsinogen to pepsin conversion with something alkaline like bicarb will save the peptide from the pepsin breakdown. The arginate form protects it against the acidity but a buffer you can use whatever you want to use as your buffer. You can even drink a heap of alkaline water or something before you take even the acetate form and you'll get a better absorption orally. Tablespoon of bicarb soda with your peptides, you might get a bit of reflux or issues with the bicarb but it'll protect the peptides from the proteolytic breakdown.

Ben:  Faith, family, fitness, health, performance, nutrition, longevity, ancestral living, biohacking, and a whole lot more. Welcome to the show.

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Alright, if you're taking supplements but not taking a probiotic, you're probably overlooking your gut. And, that obviously affects your entire body's health, which is why adding a probiotic–and, this is crucial, some kind of prebiotic that feeds that probiotic to your daily routine can be a real game changer for your health. Now, this is where this stuff called Seed comes in, S-E-E-D. It seeds your gut. See what they did there? So, it turns out a lot of what we think about probiotics is wrong like fermented foods and beverages; kimchi, kombucha, kefir, they don't actually contain adequate amounts of probiotics, it's kind of a myth. Scientifically speaking, most fermented foods and beverages actually don't qualify. That's not to say you shouldn't either drink them, it's just that they're not a reliable source of a dense amount of beneficial and effective bacteria, otherwise known as a probiotic.

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Hey, folks. So, a few months ago, I got this special package from Australia with some very unique and pretty inventive supplement formulations. And, I get a lot of supplements, obviously. I probably get eight different bottles of things to try on a weekly basis, maybe more. But, this stuff was particularly for healing the gut or at least fixing some problematic digestive issues. I had been familiar with what many of you may have heard of in the past BPC 157 as a peptide a lot of people use for recovery. And, the lesser-known fact about BPC 157 is your gut makes it, Body Protection Compound 157, and it's not just for injuries as an injectable peptide, you can consume it orally and get some pretty impactful results as far as your gut stability and gut health goes.

Now, when I began to look at some of these supplement formulations, there was one in particular that really left out to me and made me want to get the formulator of it on the show today. It was called the Ultimate Gut Repair formula and it had a lot of French compounds you may not be familiar with like larazotide, acetate, tributyrin, something called TUDCA, things that we'll actually take a dive into today. 

But, I was just intrigued. I took it and I'm sad because I ran out of my bottle, but I felt my gut was just able to–I don't know, I tend to have a little bit of a princess gut, I think, but this seemed to make it a little bit more of a steel gut. Meaning, I could have the pizza that my wife made slathered with cheese and a sourdough bread and a glass of wine on the side and feel just absolutely fine or go out to eat to a restaurant that probably puts vegetable oils on food and eat a meal that likely didn't have a great nutritional profile at least from a cleanliness standpoint and felt good.

So, anyways, the stuff is called the Gut Repair formula, and the company is called LVLUP Health, L-V-L-U-P Health. And, my guest is Kyal Van Der Leest. Kyal's new to the supplement scene, but he has a background as a naturopathic physician, functional health coast, a nutritionist, and he's into finding orally bioavailable peptides, naturopathic botanicals kind of some fringe, and very cool nutrition supplement ingredients. He's done a lot of trial and error and he spent a lot of time studying up on this stuff. You'll get to hear his story today. 

As you're listening, everything that you hear, I'll put shownotes for it at BenGreenfieldLife.com/LVL. I believe also, although I don't have it memorized or anything that Kyal is offering some discounts on his supplements to you guys. So, I'll make sure I put all that in the shownotes as well if you hear about some of this stuff you want to try it at BenGreenfieldLife.com/LVL. Kyal, what's up, man?

Kyal:  Hey, Ben. Thanks for having me on and thanks for the comments about the product.

Ben:  Yeah, for sure. Are you actually in Australia right now?

Kyal:  I am, I am at 6:00 in the morning over here and we managed to make it work with the time zone difference. Thanks for accommodating.

Ben:  Yeah. Alright, well, you're at least awake. What's your morning routine? Do you do an energy pick me up or have coffee or jump up and down on a trampoline in the sunshine or anything?

Kyal:  Today, it was a special day, obviously, with the podcast, the nootropics have been stacked on top of each other, so acetylcholine with alpha-GPC, some Mucuna pruriens, the dopamine, and one of your favorites paraxanthine.

Ben:  Oh, yeah.

Kyal:  That stuff is incredible. I love it. Of all the nootropics I've tried or maybe some of the synthetic ones, that's one of the hardest-hitting and the best-feeling ones that I've ever consumed. So, in Australia, we don't have the Upgrade drinks but I do have access to iHerb, which is global. So, I got Shawn Wells' other paraxanthine products, the pre-workout one, and yeah. Oh, man, the swagger you get from that I know that's sort of the key term they're using to describe it. It's so true and yeah, my brain feels awesome at the moment despite the early start. 

Ben:  I didn't know that you could get paraxanthine in Australia. That's kind of the new nootropic over here. I don't think I even released my podcast about it yet, but it's sick. That stuff's amazing. But, you said you also take choline and Mucuna. Is that a stack specifically that is meant to be taken together?

Kyal:  It's basically a stack to push dopamine and acetylcholine to get my brain working as well as possible. And, the drink Upgrade is not available in Australia, but MuscleTech, I believe, are the other company who have access to paraxanthine with the affinity. And, yeah, you can buy on iHerb globally. So, happily, that's how I managed to get onto it. And, I've been taking it for a good two months now and it's directly replaced all pre-workouts for me and I'm barely even consuming caffeine anymore because of that. But, yeah, taking the Mucuna and a heap of ketone salt because obviously, you've spoken about it in the past. Magnesium beta-hydroxybutyrate is my favorite form and yeah, just that energy pick you get. So, that's how I've started my day.

Ben:  Yeah. A quick, quick thing. I think you called it Upgrade. It's Update. I called it Upgrade forever because I think Upgrade's a better name for an energy drink, but it's actually Update.

The ketone salts though, did you know that to actually get adequate levels of your millimolar values of ketones high enough, the amount of salts you have to consume is actually either extremely acidic or enormous amount of salt, it's almost like an unhealthy amount of salts. And so, the other problem with the salts is the configuration. A lot of them are using an isomer that isn't absorbed by the body that well. And, I'm convinced increasingly that when it comes to using ketones that esters are the way to go, like beta-hydroxybutyrate with 1,3-butanediol. And, these salts which is like a ketone, for those you're listening in, we're getting all geeky here, bound to a salt–I don't know if you've compared the salts to the ester before, but I think the ester is just far superior.

Kyal:  I agree. The ester I've had and used, and it definitely had a stronger mental pick-me-up, it's just accessibility. I only had the salts and they do a little bit, not a lot comparatively. Yeah, you're definitely right there. And, obviously with those potential side effects of taking the salt siesta just makes a lot more sense.

Ben:  Yeah. Alright. Well, at least you're awake now. That's good.

Tell me how did you get into supplements and formulations and biochemistry?

Kyal:  My journey sort of began about 9, 10 years ago now when my mom was diagnosed with cancer. For a lot of people, you have to have these really difficult things happen to you to sort of propel you into where you're going to be. I kind of compare Max Lugavere with his mom. His mom had Alzheimer's, and that sort of set his trajectory forward and he became absolutely obsessed with researching it. And, not say that I'm like him, but with cancer, I did the same thing with my mom, I really felt the need to help her because there really wasn't much being offered at the time besides the standard of care. So, I dove deep into the work of Thomas Seyfried, Dom D'Agostino, and looked at mitochondrial health. And then, you can't help but become a biohacker when you start looking into mitochondrial health. And, that led me to podcasts like yours and Bukowski's and Dave Asprey. Basically, most of my learning is big part thanks to you and your podcast, but also there's dozens of fantastic resources online. So, that was while I was studying to be a nutritionist.

And, when I finished nutrition, I got a job at a hyperbaric oxygen facility, which was an awesome place to start. That's the only time I actually practiced with clients was at that facility. I'm a naturopath now, but I've never actually been a naturopath and worked with people one-on-one apart from while I was studying at a health food store. But, the hyperbaric oxygen facility where I worked was just trial by fire and one of the most formative years of my life because people who have hyperbaric oxygen treatments tend to either be elite performing athletes or very sick individuals with a chronic disease.

Ben:  Or, like burns or wound victims.

Kyal:  Yeah, exactly. So, being the technician there, I really just lapped up everything I could from these patients to learn what have you tried, what's been helping, chronic diseases, people with traumatic brain injuries. And, the low-hanging fruit for hyperbaric was the diabetes. So, you'll learn about GDAs and people with Alzheimer's. You'll learn about peptides like cerebral lysine and you'll learn the works of Max Lugavere and yourself.

So, that job combined with working at a health food store were really how I got into supplements formulations and natural health.

Ben:  Interesting. So, you so you don't actually work with patients anymore, you're just running the LVLUP company?

Kyal:  Yeah, exactly. It's sort of got a bit out of hand that running the company, it's definitely a full-time job now. And, in Australia, there are a lot of loopholes to jump through to be a practitioner. And, what you can and can't recommend is pretty tightly regulated. So, I think even if I was a naturopathic practitioner over here, they would be slapping some wrists for some of the ingredients I used. There's what are called registered goods over here. And, pretty much everything that I use is not a registered good because it just takes so much time for those in this country to be registered and they really restrict things. 

It's like if you're a cook and you want to make a cake, they give you five ingredients. So, five ingredients to work with over here. You don't really have that ability to add your own flair to things or to bring new compounds like peptides in or these novel ingredient, novel forms like dihydroberberine, for example. You wouldn't be able to use that, but berberine you would. So, yeah, it's pretty restrictive over here and that's why I don't practice. But, yeah, this supplement company keeps me busy. I'm happy.

Ben:  Yeah. That's got to be frustrating. Yeah, I had a chat. I was at the Spartan Race a few years ago and there were some people from an Australian supplements company called ATP Science over there. And, they had similar complaints. They said they were just always getting their hands slapped. It had very limited access to ingredients. And, I was actually surprised when you sent me some of your formulas because the gut one actually is kind of advanced as far as some of the things that are in it. So, I was surprised coming out of Australia that it was that and not just, I don't know, L-glutamine or something like that that's a little bit simpler to wrap your head around. So, has it been difficult? Have you had issues with folks trying to shut you down or anything like that?

Kyal:  So far, no. Maybe, after this podcast released is that might change, but–

Ben:  Oops. Alright, for anybody from the Australian government listening in, it's just bananas and chia seeds. That's it, right?

Kyal:  Exactly, exactly, pixie dust formula.

Ben:  Yeah, yeah.

Kyal:  But, so far no, because I'm really not making therapeutic claims around anything that isn't a therapeutic good. So, I'm not overstepping bounds and non-compliant products. I'm not actually trying to make them compliant with regulations. They are non-compliant and there's so many supplements available over here that fit into that category. So, yeah, I've got to manage to get away with that so far. If it's changed, then I'll just move it overseas. I've made my whole livelihood based around it too, so I don't really want to stop it.

Ben:  Yeah, yeah.

And, how did you get interested particularly in the gut? Because I think, I even heard you use the term “leaky gut” at one point, which I think still kind of sort of gets laughed at in modern medicine. At least, that's been my experience, but I'm curious for you. Was it leaky gut that first got you going on this road? And, if so, what do you think of that whole term “leaky gut”?

Kyal:  Yeah. So, gut health is pretty much one of the core naturopathic tenants and principles. Hippocrates coined “All health begins in the gut.” So, that mindset of studying naturopathy sort of got me thinking, “Oh, it actually really does all begin in the gut, and you are what you digest.” And, if you've got a dysfunction in any organ, most of it or any disease process, most of it can be stemmed back either from the gut or the gut being a contributing factor to a said disease. So, I got into that. 

And also, I've had my own issues with leaky gut and food sensitivities and being exposed to mold as well that's like a Stanley knife to your gut lining, it will just completely rip it open. So, I've had horrible gut issues in the past from mold exposure. Even while I had BPC at my disposal, if you're still around mold, it's not going to fix the problem. So, I've definitely dealt with gut issues my whole life, but the main reason I actually developed the GI Repair Formula was for a former housemate who had Crohn's disease and was getting pretty bad to the point where they were considering putting her on a stroma bag.

And so, I can't have this, I have to try and figure out something for her. And, funnily enough, she actually was a nurse, so she'd never actually thought naturopathic stuff or nutritional therapies were of any benefit. So, she never even took the product that I made for her. But, since then, it's helped thousands of people. And, yeah, it's basically just an IBD formulation is why I made it.

Ben:  Yeah. Back to that whole “It all begins with a gut” thing, I don't want to be contrarian because I already know I was talking about the benefits of ketone esters versus ketone salts. I sometimes think in functional medicine and naturopathic medicine that phrase is sometimes overused. 

Now, I would estimate it's probably 70 to 80% of stuff starts with the gut if we say that the gut would include the mouth too because I think that the oral biome, the shape of the jaw and the teeth and the mouth, the production of enzymes starting in the mouth, et cetera, is something that's often underdiagnosed or underlooked at, people who just have mouth issues before they have gut issues. 

But then, I have seen and experienced myself profound shifts in health, energy, sleep, healing, et cetera, from things like addressing fascial adhesions and really good deep tissue work and sometimes months and months of deep tissue work to reinvent the body, especially in somebody who's been a former athlete or another example would be the brain neurotransmitter imbalances from improper use of nootropics and smart drugs or antidepressants or some type of issue with the blood-brain barrier, et cetera. Another big one is emotions. There's whole books about that like “The Body Keeps The Score” and “The Emotion Code” that dictate that someone could have a pristine gut and a poor emotional profile or poor mood or not a healthy spiritual practice and still fighting uphill battle with their health. 

So, my take on the gut is I think a lot of it starts with the gut, but I don't think it all starts with the gut.

Kyal:  Alright. Sorry, that was a bit too much of a sweeping. I 100% agree with that and even myself too, I'm so gut focused. But, after living in mold, I had colonization of mold in my sinuses, so no matter what I did even removing myself, I had to address the sinus cavity before I could actually heal and reduce the toxin release from the mold that was colonized in my sinuses. And then, of course, your relationships with people. If you're chronically stressed with people, then that's going to affect catecholamine release and they're inflammatory to the gut too. So, you're right, it is above that. And, even as well if we want to go a step further your environment too, if you're being nuked with EMFs every day, if you've got Bluetooth headphones on or a laptop on, your gut is getting inflammation from that. It's going to basically lead to leaky gut as well. 

So, we can keep going back and back and go even to past lives and things like the Dutch famine as well, the studies around that. So, you can go back and back, but I feel like from the most practical perspective, if someone's going to take a supplement to work on themselves, then maybe the gut is where you start. But, the free stuff, the meditations, being a part of a community, that's definitely above gut health and that's where I'd like most people to start and look at before they take supplements for their gut.

Ben:  Yeah. Ideally, obviously, use a holistic approach and go after it all. But, the mold thing is interesting. Tell me about that. You said it colonizes the mouth and you got to break it down or something like that?

Kyal:  It actually colonized my sinuses. And, when I started taking–I did neti pots and sinus cleanses and a small amount. I really got to iterate a small amount of N-acetyl cysteine in a few biofilm busters in there. And, when I did that over about a week of flushing these just almighty biofilms with mold colonized in them would come out of my nose, and, ah, the relief you get when you pass one of those biofilms is when you've taken the best pill of your life but in your nose.

Ben:  Yeah.

Kyal:  So, being able to actually breathe for the first time, in what was months for me after the exposure, was just life-changing, and then the reduction in neuroinflammation I had after that. Because the sinus cavities or there's a very small membrane between the brain and the sinuses, that's why a lot of people use intranasal as a delivery mechanism for things like peptides or even other compounds. So, not having that small trickle of oxytocin go into my hippocampus and affect my cognition was just probably one of the most profound health upgrades that I've ever been able to do for myself. 

And, I just for weeks prior to that were taking all the para cleanses and all the binders, internal mold. But, I never actually got up here before all of the gut lining. So, that was hugely impactful and it helped me. And, yeah, to this day, I'm glad I can still breathe. And, I've always got a neti pot handy in case I sort of go into a place with mold just to clear that out. And, it's a very beneficial tool for a lot of people to have if they're unavoidably exposing themselves to mold spores.

Ben:  I have a similar approach when I'm traveling especially in staying in an Airbnb or even on an airplane. I actually use a glutathione nasal spray with some essential oils in it. It's made by my friend, Dr. John Lieurance at MitoZen. And, it kind of burns but you do a couple sprays into each nostril and it seems to help out quite a bit also with just general immunity when traveling the neti pot trick or a lot of people we're doing this during COVID-like saline rinses. It can be pretty powerful. There's like a salt solution like that. It kind of makes you wonder how many people are walking around with mold or biofilm, especially in the nasal cavity. 

That same guy who I mentioned, John Lieurance, he does cranial balloon adjustments in the nose where they — I don't know if you've ever had this done, Kyal, where they put a balloon up the nose, inflate it, and it's almost a chiropractic adjustment for the skull. And, after you do it, sometimes you get this huge release of mucus and strangely colored flecks and specks coming from the nose and your head feels clear as a bell. I've had it done a few times and every time I wonder, gosh, and somebody who's never had this done, does that just mean you're walking around your whole life just kind of gummed up with things that are built up since childhood?

Kyal:  It could be. I know Mike Mutzel, he's done a video on YouTube where he actually has a scan of his sinuses and he can see how congested and how backed up his sinus cavity was. And, if it gets really bad, they could even get in there and remove it manually. But, I think for most people, just doing steaming, getting the steam up your nose is a really good way to dislodge it. But, if those biofilms, you definitely need to do something that's going to break them down through the neti pot. So, yeah, that was a really beneficial thing. 

And, getting rid of that sort of this systemic effects for my whole body was awesome. Mold is such a shit thing to have happen to you in your body. It's so disruptive to hormones. It's so disruptive. Satiety reduces MSH in your body. And, that has a huge knock-on effect at almost every system in the body. And, it was really almost embarrassing for me to have gut issues as the formulator of what I call the Ultimate Repair and still have issues with my gut. But, when I was in the mold, there was no amount of BPC that could fix it because it's just that damaging to the gut lining.

Ben:  Yeah, yeah. Well, that's the whole wounded healer approach. I don't think there's anything wrong with having an issue and have to be dealing with that issue while simultaneously presenting the solutions you've discovered to the world. I think sometimes you have a little bit more of a practical trench-based approach in a situation like that. So, I get where you're coming from.

And, this formula, I mean, I know we've alluded to it a few times, I want to get into it momentarily, but I had one more question about mold and this idea of biofilms because I've had to work with a few people. And, I'm not a doctor and I don't practice medicine, but some advice I've given to people that seems to have really moved the dial for candida and yeast and fungus has been high-dose proteolytic enzymes, silkworm extracts, serrapeptase, trypsin, chymotrypsin, papain, bromelain, et cetera, in high doses multiple times per day to, from what I understand, break down the biofilm, and then you combine that with an herbal antimicrobial or antifungal agent like oil of oregano, and that seems to be a really good one-two combo. But, the idea of using proteolytic enzymes to break down biofilm, do you think something like that would be effective for mold also?

Kyal:  It's almost as if you listed off upcoming formulation that I'm going to make. The enzymes, I really like tyrosinase, which breaks down actual mold and candida, nattokinase, glucoamylase, and lumbrokinase is another one that are really good. But, it doesn't necessarily need to be really these specific forms like most of these proteolytic enzymes. If they can get systemic, if they're going to survive the gut lining, they get into a colonized gut, then they're fantastic. But, having taken those, I didn't actually use them in the sinus cavity which I wish I did, but I'm not really sure if there'd be any contraindications to taking proteolytic enzymes in your nasal cavity. It could eat away at the tissue there. I don't think it would because there's plenty of mucus in there to sort of protect you, but I never did those but potentially if I get it again, I might try that out and see how it goes. But, I did have a friend who nebulized the proteolytic enzymes, and definitely not a good idea to do that because the lung, I don't think, is meant to have any proteolytic enzymes in it. And, it really burns the lungs and he was coughing after, so.

Ben:  Alright, folks, it's time for Bubs. That's right, Glen and Sean, the co-founder at a company called Bubs were both coaches at SEALFIT in Encinitas owned by Navy SEAL Commander, Mark Divine. They put on this fantastic event called KOKORO, which was like a Navy SEAL-style hell week for civilians. These guys as coaches got to know each other. And, tragically what happened was that Glen who was a best friend of hundreds wound up laying down his life-saving Americans in Benghazi, Libya. And, he was always about self-improvement about helping other people. And so, what Sean wound up doing was founding this company Bubs Natural as a tribute to Glen. As a matter of fact, Bubs donates 10% of all its profits to charity in Glen's honor. 

And, what does Bubs make? Well, bubs has some of the best collagen you'll ever have. Collagen is like the glue that holds your body together. It's truly unflavored, but it's extremely soluble. So, you can put in anything and it's better than a lot of the collagens out there because they use the purest form of collagen, sustainably sourced from grass-fed and pasture-raised cows in southern Brazil and Uruguay. They also have an MCT oil that pairs very well with the collagen. It's actually the only MCT oil in the world that's Whole30-approved, meaning it is super clean. They make apple cider vinegar gummies, which are actually pretty amazing for just quelling your appetite at night, healthy digestion, blood sugar management. And then, they have their Fountain of Youth collagen where they take their really good collagen, they blend it with vitamin C and Biotin and maqui berry, which is a Chilean berry, very high in antioxidants. Put all that together, you got Bubs Naturals. And, it's supporting a very good cause, Glen, who was a larger-than-life personality glowed with enthusiasm, he loved to feel great and do good and that's what they created Bubs to allow you to do. So, BubsNaturals.com, B-U-B-S-Naturals.com. Use code BENG to save 20% on Bubs Naturals.

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That is interesting. I guess, I've only thought about oral consumption for getting into the bloodstream, et cetera. But, I wasn't proposing spraying it up the nose, but yeah, that's interesting. But, you think the saline rinse will break down the mold biofilm pretty well?

Kyal:  The saline and maybe some of the botanicals like some citrus essential oils. There's an essential oil blend called citrine cleansers, I've forgotten exactly the name of it, but yeah, it's just citrus-based. You could use other things like grapefruit extract that's a really good one. There's actually a product coming out from a company, I believe, Cymbiotika.

Ben:  Yeah.

Kyal:  They're bringing out a ParaX out. It's got some very, very interesting new compounds. One's called caffeic acid phenethyl ester. And, that seems to be one of the best ingredients that you could use for taking care of both parasites and mold at the same time. And, that's in this really almost overdone in what they put in it. But, I really like that. It sort of fits with my philosophy of they've just made an all-in-one parasite and candida mold cleanse product and it looks absolutely amazing if you look at the ingredient panel on it.

Ben:  Is that the ParaX by Cymbiotika?

Kyal:  I think it's called ParaX. It might be something else, but yeah, Cymbiotika's new parasite.

Ben:  I'll hunt it down and put a link to it in the shownotes for folks. Actually, I found the ingredient label right here. Yeah, phytonoic, andrographolide and phytosure, curcuminoids, ellagic acid, bisoline and baicalin, luteolin and cafeic acid phenethyl ester, along with monolaurin from coconut oil, oregano. Wow. This is a pretty intense formula. Interesting.

Kyal:  Yeah. As I said, I was working on something for myself for LVLUP and then I saw this one, I'm like, “Oh, damn, you bet me to it.”

Ben:  That's happened. That's happened to me at Kion before.

Kyal:  I didn't actually answer one of your questions before. You sort of were touching about leaky guts if their terms even accepted.

Ben:  Oh, yeah.

Kyal:  I think it's gradually getting more accepted by people, but it's still a colloquialism just something people use just in general speak more so than you would at your doctor's office. They use the term “intestinal hyperpermeability.” And, I think that's way more accepted. And, if you use Google Scholar or PubMed and search intestinal hyperpermeability, you're going to get substantially more results if you're looking into condition. So, that's the key term to use. That leaky gut's definitely a thing, whatever you want to call it.

Zonulin is a huge factor in leaky gut. Zonulin protein is triggered by stresses like gliadin from gluten, pesticides. Let's say these and certain toxins, they bind to the outside of the enterocytes of the intestine. Once those molecules bind to it, your epithelium release this molecule called zonulin. Zonulin is something you can test for in both blood and fecal, but this is basically a marker of leaky gut because the more zonulin you have, the more permeable your gut membrane will be. The gut membrane is like a mesh and zonulin basically increases the pore size of your mesh to let things in. It has a physiological role. It's not all bad. We need certain amounts of zonulin to increase absorption of certain things from the diet, but too much in chronic release of this is what would lead to something like leaky gut and can actually lead to things like food sensitivities. 

A lot of the time people who eat the same food almost every day for a whole year will develop a sensitivity of the food. It happened to me with eggs. And, this is because some of the fragments of the egg that you've eaten, some of the amino acids of that in due time will actually cross that membrane barrier and then interact with your immune system. And then, you might get an IgG response to even healthy foods. It just happens when you don't eat seasonally.

Ben:  Interesting.

Kyal:  That can go away. It won't end up as a long-term immune response to that like an allergy. It's just like accumulation effect. And, zonulin is one of the key contributors to things crossing the gut membrane.

Ben:  Yeah.

Kyal:  There's plenty of other things that contribute to leaky gut, but I think the main thing to focus on is how do you actually fix this if you've tested your gut. You can test it, as I said, in fecal or in serum and see your zonulin levels. But, you can also do something called the GI map, which is a fecal microbe test. I believe you've done one of those before, yeah.

Ben:  Yup, I have multiple times. Yeah.

Kyal:  Oh, they're so fun to do digging through your poo.

Ben:  Yeah, with a little hot dog tray and a little spoon and the tubes that they include with it. Yeah, I think the three-day panel by Genova Diagnostics is a good one because a lot of times if you're looking, especially at parasites, you're not going to catch them so to speak with just a one snapshot of a measurement, you got to do multiple days in a row to really get a good profile of the bacteria in the biome and the critters in the gut. But yeah, I think anybody who hasn't done a gut test yet back to the reason that you were indicating many health issues arise beginning with the gut. I think, anybody who's concerned about their long-term health should test it. I don't even think you need a full biome bacterial profile like a gut biome or a biome or something like that. I think even just getting a Genova Diagnostics that's going to give you parasites, yeast, fungus, candida, et cetera, is a good way to go.

And, for those of you listening in, zonulin, it can be confusing, but zonulin would increase the permeability of the tight junctions between the cells. And so, A, if you're talking to your doctor, don't use the term “leaky gut” like Kyal just said. If you want them to take you seriously and sound smart, use the term “high intestinal permeability” or something like that, something more multi-syllabic. And then, the other thing is with zonulin, you technically want to decrease the activity of zonulin. Have you ever looked into colostrum for that, by the way, Kyal?

Kyal:  Yeah, I have. I love colostrum. A lot of coaches that I work with use that in their protocols. It's just one of those things that certain people might have a reaction to it being a dairy instead. It's hit or miss, but in theory, it's fantastic.

Ben:  Yeah, I'm sensitive to dairy, but I feel great on colostrum. So, I'll do typically a couple of colostrum smoothies each week that'll just make my usual smoothie, would just put boatloads of colostrum in it and I always feel amazing with that.

Now, the Gut Repair Formula, I want to get into that because it's kind of complex. So, tell me about the Gut Repair Formula and the actual ingredients that are in it and what they're actually doing. I realize that's an evolved question because there's multiple ingredients, but I'd love to hear you fill me in on the details of it.

Kyal:  Yeah, sure. So, there's basically a combination of peptides and then combined with some of the most powerful nutritional and naturopathic compounds that I could find that you can fit in a capsule. Obviously, there's things like marshmallow root, there's things like L-glutamine. But, you need a really high dose of those and sort of long-term use to get benefit from those. The ingredients that I've used in this formulation peptides are huge, huge potential for what they can do for people. Not only for gut health, but for medicine. I'm not the first and I won't be the last to say this, but peptides are the future of medicine. Most of them don't have toxicity, especially if they're found somewhere in the body like BPC as you mentioned at the start of the show that's found in your stomach acid. It's a stomach acid secretion. 

And, the reason why your stomach secretes it is to protect your stomach from the hydrochloric acid. If you get something an ulcer or if you get H. pylori or something that's affecting the integrity of the stomach, that can be catastrophic for the body. If you have a leak of hydrochloric acid into your torso, that would be the end of it for you. That's not a good situation, acid burning through your body. So, your body has a heap, it's a really thick org in the stomach. So, that's one contingency. There's a heap of mucus in it, so there's another. But, I believe these peptides produced in there to heal that organ as fast as possible because, as I said, that's game over if that organ goes wrong. But yeah, so BPC is body protection compound.

Ben:  A quick question about BPC. Obviously, for the purposes of repairing the gut or affecting the gut, oral administration seems to just make intuitive common sense. But, if someone were to inject BPC 157 using the traditional peptide administration route of using an insulin syringe to inject, do you think if they didn't have access to oral BPC 157, there'd still be an effect on the integrity of the gut?

Kyal:  Yeah, because it ends up in circulation. This is something that I've sort of amused with with other people in the space whether oral versus injectable. Does it actually matter when it all ends up in circulation anyway? And, Jean-Francois said peptides are they're smart in the sense that they will go to areas of inflammation. They're not going to just enter cells that don't need them, they're sort of–the term “bioregulator” is one that's been used, and I think peptides definitely fit that description as well. They don't do anything if they're not needed. If there's a site of inflammation, then they'll just attract themselves to it and stimulate all these repair processes. But, if there's actually no need for it, it'll just circulate and then be broken down in circulation by hydrolyzed enzymes. But, to answer your question, if someone had injectable form of BPC, you can inject that and it would have listed some benefits but it's sort of like you want to get as close to the side of injury as possible. If you have gut issues, oral just makes sense, it's going to go directly through your GI tract and get to wherever it's needed to.

Another way that you can do it is if you have large bowel pathologies like IBD, Crohn's, or colitis is there are BPC suppositories, which is another way you can do it. That bypasses the chance that all the BPC you take through the mouth might get used up earlier in the small intestines or in the stomach. So, for people who have large bowel pathologies, you almost need to do a higher dose to sort of oversaturate the earlier parts of the digestive system to actually let it get down there. But then, that has actually worked in practice, but this is sort of where it's a bit contradictory. It enters circulation, so you even need to do that anyway. That's something that I think needs to be studied a bit better by people in this space. But, unfortunately, I'm not seeing too much new BPC research coming out, and that's obviously because it's a non-patentable natural compound that the money that it costs to study this, it's not really being pushed.

Ben:  Yeah, not a lot of financial.

Now, what about the other peptide? And, I want to hear about the other ingredients as well because many people will find great results from just taking oral BPC 157, which by the way, I think you have that available on your website, just BPC 157 all by itself, right?

Kyal:  I really hate useless fillers in products, so I've added palmitoylethanolamide, PEA, as the filler along with hyaluronic acid which would synergize with BPC 157's effect on collagen networks. So, I piggyback those two together and put a bit of sodium bicarbonate too because when taking peptides orally, buffering the pepsinogen to pepsin conversion with something alkaline like bicarb will save the peptide from the pepsin breakdown. The arginate form used protects it against the acidity, but a buffer–you can use whatever you want to use as your buffer. You can even drink a heap of alkaline water or something before you take even the acetate form and you'll get a better absorption orally, tablespoon of bicarb soda with your peptides. You might get a bit of reflux or issues with the bicarb, but it'll protect the peptides from the proteolytic breakdown.

Ben:  Wow, that's an amazing tip. That's really good to know. So, if you were to take oral BPC 157 all by itself, the acidic environment combined with some of the cofactors not being necessary for a high enough bioavailability would dictate that, like you mentioned, it's not going to reach the collagen that works as effectively or have as great an impact on the gut.

Kyal:  Exactly. Yeah. There's three forms that most people use. Injectable, they tend to use the acetate form. This form is about eight times cheaper than the arginate form. The arginate form is the one they call the stable form. This is the form that has this 90% bioavailability and it's capable of withstanding the stomach acid. But, the thing with that is it does withstand the stomach acid and when they test it, they basically just put it in acid and correct. It does withstand it but not factored into that are the proteolytic enzymes. So, whenever you're taking any oral peptides, I recommend people take it away from a high-protein meal. If you've just eaten a big chunk of steak or a piece of chicken, your stomach acid is going to drop as close to one as it's capable doing and it's going to upregulate a heap of the proteolytic enzymes to break down that chicken, all that stuff. And then, if you put GI Repair or regen, BPC, KPV, any oral peptide after that, you're not really giving it a good chance to be absorbed.

Ben:  Okay. And, you use the arginine form in both your formulas that have BPC.

Kyal:  Yeah, yeah. Nothing but the best form I'm not going to waste people's time with the acetate.

Ben:  Okay, cool. So, the BPC 157 is the first ingredient and obviously one of the major staples of the Gut Repair Formula, but what else do you have in there?

Kyal:  The second peptide in there is KPV. This is a fragment of melanocyte-stimulating hormone, alpha MSH, which is the parent peptide of quite a few different peptide fragments. So, there is melanotan, melanotan 1 and 2. They both come from MSH. I believe you've used them in the past. Quite interesting effect. KPV, KdPT, there's all these fragments of this main MSH peptide. And, by only using a fragment, you're basically selecting. It's like a selective peptide modulator rather than a sum, which is a selective androgen. By breaking them down to a fragment, the KPV is a 3 amino acid fragment of MSH. It basically makes it more specific to certain receptors. 

We've got five key melanocortin receptors, MC1 receptor that's responsible for your tanning, for hair color. That's where melanotan shines. It really has a strong affinity for that one. Melanotan actually works on most of the receptors. But, something like KPV will work on the other benefits of the melanocortin system in the body. It'll bind more to the 3 and the 4. And, the 3 is responsible for energy homeostasis. It's responsible for the 2. It also binds 2, which is responsible for adrenals and steroidogenesis. And, I believe PT-141 is another one of these MSH fragments. And, that has more of an affinity for the two. And, that's why lot of people use it as a sexual arousal peptide and– 

Ben:  like a bodybuilder who would use melanotan for increased skin pigmentation. The side effect is often priapism, erections that will not go away. I had a similar experience that you just alluded to where I'd take it because I wanted to just see what it did and how it worked, but the problem is trying to sleep with an erection. It's nearly impossible. And so, I didn't like the way I felt on that stuff very much either way, but this KPV, that's more of something that's found in or makes up part of the larger melanotan. But, by itself, it's actually having more anti-microbial, anti-inflammatory, antifungal type of effects on the gut.

Kyal:  Precisely. It just represents unwanted side effects of–I mean, I wouldn't mind if it tanned me without giving me uncontrollable erections. That would be good, but it basically removes the binding to the 1, which is responsible for the tanning. It has a lower affinity for the ones that stimulate sexual arousal, and it's more focused on the immune system, the immune cells. Certain immune cells have melanocortin receptors too. And, that's why KPV is a fantastic peptide for people who've had Lyme disease or who have chemical sensitivities. 

And, a big reason why I included it too is it comes back to mold. People who have been exposed to mold, their melanocortin MSH is substantially reduced up to a 90% reduction in endogenous MSH production. So, KPV basically is supplementing MSH in the effects that you want from MSH. So, that was really beneficial in bringing my energy back up, helping my immune system for molds and I think, Lyme disease, chronic fatigue syndrome. It's really beneficial for that because the cascade of effects, the melanocortin system have. And, brain too, you've got a heap of MC receptors in the brain. 

Ben:  Really?

Kyal:  Yeah. I think it's Semax is one of the brain peptide. Yeah, I think it binds to the melanocortin system in the brain too. And, that's where it has a really potent anti-inflammatory effects and anti-Alzheimer's effects too. In the gray matter, there's a lot of receptors for melanocortin. So, that's a benefit of going in the sun for one, but it's also benefits to MSH and why mold is so almost a prerequisite for chronic conditions. If you've been exposed to it in the past, you are increasing your chances of things like Alzheimer's because you're not making MSH; therefore, MSH isn't binding to these anti-inflammatory pathways in the brain. And, there's things you can do from there, but if you don't know–and, as we said, if people are going along with colonized mold in their sinuses for years unknowing, then you're just getting this slow little trickle and this gradual reduction in MSH production. So, yeah, KPV is fantastic for that. And, that's why I included it in the formula.

Ben:  Now, in America, one really popular peptide it seems right now is LL-37, which is an antimicrobial peptide. A lot of people swear by that, for example, for SIBO particularly. Have you heard of that? Or, is there a reason that you didn't include that one in the formula?

Kyal:  I've heard of it and I didn't include it because A, it was very difficult to get. I don't think I could get it at the time. But, B, it can cause really severe die-off reactions to people when you–

Ben:  Yeah, like a Herxheimer reaction.

Kyal:  Exactly, exactly. And, if people need it, then it's fantastic. But, I wouldn't add it to something that's for the general population because I don't want people to feel like shit after they've had the product. I want people to feel good. And, that's sort of what most people get from it, unless they have a reaction to zinc carnosines, another one of the ingredients. And, I put a heaped dose of that in there, a really clinically dosed amount of it. But, some people get nausea from zinc. I don't know if you experience any of that.

Ben:  Yeah, yeah. I think, it depends on the form like at Kion for our immune formula. I use zinc bisglycinate, which seems to be a form that doesn't cause gastric upset in people but the dose is necessary for immune support. But, yeah, some forms of zinc can cause issues. The bisglycinate seems pretty well-tolerated though.

So, BPC 157 and KPV, those would both be considered peptides. KPV, obviously, a little bit of a smaller peptide, a tripeptide, which means it's just for those of you listening in, just like peptides or 3 amino acids bound together. I notice you also have something called larazotide acetate. What's that?

Kyal:  Its code names is AT1001 for people who want to research it.

Ben:  It sounds like a secret agent.

Kyal:  License to stop zonulin. That's what its function is. And, it's very specific unlike the other two. There's like a plethora of benefits to BPC and KPV. And, when you take BPC to heal your gut, you'll actually notice reduction in neuroinflammation. It might help. It's organoprotective, so you've got these pleiotropic effects from BPC and KPV, but larazotide is more specific. 

Larazotide is simply an antagonist to zonulin. It's derived from endotoxin, I believe. I can't remember exactly, but it's an antagonist to zonulin. It binds to The receptors in which zonulin would bind to in the cells and basically prevents that hyperpermeability from even happening. The analogy I use when I describe why I use larazotide in the formula, it's like if someone has a wound on their shoulder, for example, the equivalent of putting staples in the wound or stitches, it seals it up while on the other end, you've got the two anti-inflammatory pro-angiogenic, pro-growth factor EGF peptides working from within to heal it. The larazotide is like the staples holding the gut lining or the wound together in the gut. And, it's being studied mainly for celiac disease. Obviously, zonulin and celiac. Triggering zonulin is the mechanism for that. So, it's being studied quite heavily for celiac disease. And, its nickname is the anti-celiac peptide as well.

Ben:  Really? Wow.

Kyal:  Yeah, yeah. That's colloquially what they call it. But yeah, it's one function is to inhibit zonulin. And, the other effects that you can get from inhibiting zonulin is systemic too. It's not just in your gut where zonulin has effects, zonulin can actually open up the blood-brain barrier and cause neuroinflammation. So, by inhibiting it at the gut, we inhibit its absorption into the circulation. And then, we want to prevent it from going into the blood-brain barrier because I personally believe a lot of people's brain fog is caused by leaky gut. And, the mechanism for that would be zonulin's opening, the blood-brain barrier or things like lipopolysaccharides or endotoxins or even toxins generally that are circulating should not end up in the brain. But, I believe leaky brain is a big issue at the moment that larazotide and all these–anything gut healing, anything that's going to seal the gut lining is going to benefit for the brain as well, and that sort of the gut-brain connection there through the circulation.

Ben:  Okay, got it. And then, gosh, I mean, those are only three of the ingredients. We've barely scratched the surface here, but I know that you have the zinc in there like you mentioned, zinc carnosine. Then, the other three that you have are quercetin, tributyrin, and TUDCA. And, although we may not have time to cover every single ingredient in this formula, the TUDCA particularly, that's one I've heard a lot about. A lot of people seem to be very into this TUDCA thing. Tell me about TUDCA.

Kyal:  TUDCA is actually noted in the GI Repair Formula. It's its own standard product.

Ben:  Okay. Do you stack that with this product sometimes?

Kyal:  Yeah, yeah, it's the bile salt.

Ben:  Okay.

Kyal:  You can stack it with it. It really is beneficial for SIBO like bile acids have a really great modulatory effect on bacterial overgrowth while in a high enough dose is capable of wiping out the gram-negative bacteria, placebo. So, that's one of the benefits to it. But, its main benefit is promoting drainage and phase 3 detoxification. It has a ceiling effect on the gut too. And, as I said, anything that's going to positively influence the microbiome like KPV and even some probiotics or some prebiotics, they're going to be beneficial for the gut lining. 

But, TUDCA is its own standalone product because most people need between 250 milligrams. And, if people have taken oral steroids, oral testosterone, that really has an ability to clog up the bile. And, TUDCA is a water-soluble bile salt and it thins the bile and gets it flowing a lot better. This prevents things like cholestasis. If people have elevated liver enzymes, it's just one of the quickest-acting compounds for lowering those. Again, I bring it back to when I was in mold. Mold congests and clogs up the bile. So, when I took a large dose of that, again, I had almost [00:55:27]_____ reaction to the TUDCA because it finally cleared the liver out, which is a big thing that a lot of people overlook.

And, I think when it comes to detoxification, we need to start from the gut, work our way back to drainage, so phase 3 and then we start to actually modify the phase 1 and phase 2 of the liver detoxification rather than starting with something like milk thistle, which would upregulate phase 1 and then can actually–if you don't have drainage open, if you don't have essential amino acids or glycine or NAC to support that phase 2 of liver clearance, you can actually end up with accumulation of these intermediary metabolites and cause actual liver inflammation rather than helping it.

Ben:  Wow. Okay. So, the TUDCA, arguably if you were to eat a higher fat diet, maybe a carnivore diet, a ketogenic diet, et cetera, it sounds to me that would actually help quite a bit with the production of bile to support the digestion of that. Because a lot of people get fatty stool and digestive distress from a diet like that. But, it sounds like TUDCA could fit in pretty well in a scenario like that.

Kyal:  Absolutely. The lowest hanging fruit for TUDCA is it's basically a direct replacement for people who take ox bile. It'll give you all of the fat absorption as ox bile would. But then, it has all these other effects such as helping the liver, which ox bile doesn't do. And then, it also has beneficial effects for reducing endoplasmic reticulum stress. So, it helps with protein folding as well, helps mitochondrial production, and also helps with the conversion of T4 to T3. It helps the deionize enzymes into the thyroid conversion in the liver. 

So, one of my friends who's a coach in Australia took it and he asked me if I'd lace the product with anything because he had such an uptick in energy. He had a little bit of mold in his environment, but taking the TUDCA cleared out his liver and then also really positively affected his thyroid conversion through to the active T3 and he felt amazing from it, really energized purely from something. That's a side reason why someone would take TUDCA rather than the primary. So, as a direct replacement for ox bile, it's fantastic.

You had Dane Johnson, CrohnsColitis.

Ben:  Yeah, CrohnsColitisLifestyle. He's fantastic.

Kyal:  Yeah, he's awesome. He loves TUDCA. He uses that for most of his patients with GI issues and anyone who's been old or anyone who's got problems with drainage, which is a lot of people nowadays. So, [00:57:48] _____ also have a good TUDCA as well and I think they've got a proprietary blend of TUDCA with some melatonin and a few other things. But, that's TUDCA, that's not actually even part of the GI Repair, but that's just one of my favorite products.

Ben:  What are the other ingredients in the GI Repair then besides the BPC 157, the KPV, and the larazotide?

Kyal:  Well, that's where the naturals come in. The zinc carnosine, I've got a dose. I think it's at 50 milligrams. I think you get a zinc carnosine from that. And, that's why people end up with gastric distress. I think the average supplemental dose of zinc is about equivalent to 10 milligrams, which for most people is fine. But, 50 is a big dose and that's why maybe one out of 10 people might have some degree of upset stomach from GI Repair in which case you just split the dose. And, that'll give you 25. But again, still if people have issues with that, then taking it with some fats or some carbohydrates will prevent that.

That zinc carnosine, that's fantastic for soothing the stomach. Carnosine in and of itself is just a fantastic amino acid. But, when you combine it with zinc, which has a strong healing effect on the gut lining and very important–and, the reason why people with IBD really struggle to fix their gut is because of the damage to the gut lining. You don't get very good absorption of dietary zinc. So, zinc is one of the key minerals that we need for healing the gut lining. So, zinc carnosine, just I couldn't think of a better form to use for healing the gut.

Then, there's tributyrin, which is a really bioavailable form of butyrate. And, butyrate it's just a short-chain fatty acid which feeds the enterocytes and the colonocytes, really potent anti-inflammatory too. It's a histone deacetylase inhibitor.

Ben:  Okay.

Kyal:  So, a lot of people with colorectal cancer are taking big doses of this to sort of help them. But, it inhibits the NF-kappa beta inflamazone and it's a COX-2 inhibitor as well. So, there's a few different forms of butyrate you can supplement. I think it's BodyBio, have calcium magnesium butyrate. But, the [00:59:44] _____ I think is the best and provides the most butyrate. I think there's three butyric acid molecules bound to glycerol and it's capable of getting through the stomach acid and through the entire small and large intestine.

Ben:  Okay. Now, butyrate, it's very much a part of the colonic environment. And, I know part of a healthy large intestine. Have you ever heard of people using these butyrate enemas like taking butyric acid up the other end?

Kyal:  Yeah, I think Dane just mentioned it to me that he was using most of what's in GI Repair, he's given to people as suppositories or enemas or got them compounded that way. So, it would be good. I can't imagine it would be the most pleasant thing to have because tributyrin tastes and smells like fermented cheese.

Ben:  Yeah, it doesn't smell that great.

Kyal:  No. I don't think any of the butyrate's forms are great. TUDCA is another one which is horrible. It took its sort of smells and tastes like nail polish remover because it's an acid. But, back to butyrate, yeah, you could definitely do it as an enema, I would suggest for people with large bowel pathologies, Crohn's, and colitis doing things as suppositories or enemas is going to get these compounds as quickly and as efficiently as possible to the site of inflammation. But, you can definitely do them orally as well. I've had thousands of customers, many of which have large bowel pathologies. And, they've definitely noticed a huge improvement in their conditions taking the formula, taking things like TUDCA, and then just general anti-inflammatories on top of that too. As far as gut healing goes, BPC is the powerhouse of the formula.

Ben:  Yeah.

Kyal:  But, when you combine BPC, which stimulates all these growth factors with other things which synergize with those growth factor stimulations with the anti-inflammatory effects with the pro got healing effects of these compounds and even just the energy substrate for the colonic cells as well with the butyrate, you're overlapping on so many mechanisms which are important to hit if you really want to nourish the gut and help heal the gut lining.

Ben:  Yeah, that makes sense. I mean, it seems it can cover so many bases, this formula. You mentioned you have quercetin in there also.

Kyal:  Yeah, I've got two forms of quercetin. There's anhydrous, which has terrible bioavailability. I think it's only 2%. But, I kept that in there because it's actually really good if it's embedding itself in the mucosa of the stomach lining and not getting systemic, then it's having a local effect. It's preventing histamine in the lumen. Histamine is another thing that can cause a flushing reaction in the body. If people have histamine intolerance or mast cell activation syndrome, they have chronically high levels of histamine. And, this can be due to something like a parasite or food sensitivities or whatever the cause is. The effect is the histamine opens the permeability of the gut lining to try and get stuff out of your body to flush it out and then you end up with something like diarrhea. And then, systemically histamine, too, gives you the effects of itchy eyes, runny nose, and yeah. So, quercetin is one of the best mast cells stabilizing ingredients that I could use and mast cells definitely contribute. It also has a direct sealing effect on the gut as well. 

And then, the other form of quercetin I used is one called enzymatically modified isoquercetin, EMIQ.

Ben:  Okay.

Kyal:  This works on the other side of the gut lining. So, anhydrous is sort of in the lumen and EMIQ has 40 times the absorption supposedly from the manufacturer that are 40 times more bioavailable form of quercetin. So, this gets systemic. This gets on the other side of the gut lining. And, this is going to have antihistamine effects in the body. It's one of the best antihistamines, maybe bar something like diamine oxidase, DAO. It's probably the second-best of the mast cell stabilizing ingredients. And, you really don't need much due to its high bioavailability, just such a great compound. You can get it on iHerb. You can get it in GI Repair. And, for anyone who has seasonal allergies, there's nothing better than EMIQ, in my opinion.

Ben:  Yeah, yeah. Well, I mean, when you look at gut issues, everything from the mast cell and histamine sensitivities that you've described to intestinal permeability, to candida, yeast, through other fungus, to the mold that you talked about, to sensitivities to certain things like gluten or lactose, to poor bile production or gallbladder or liver function, there's so many reasons. But, in your description, and correct me if I'm wrong, it sounds like this formula is a shotgun formula just covering all the bases for each of those different issues that could cause problematic gut issues.

Kyal:  Exactly. It's key goal is to fix leaky gut, the hyperpermeability. There are times when it won't work. If someone has horrible dysbiosis or candida overgrowth like KPV has an effect on the immune system which then the immune system might be able to take care of the overgrowth. It might [01:04:38] _____. The immune system clears overgrowth. These histamines try and flush things out as I said earlier. But, a lot of the time I find, this product will work really well for anyone with leaky gut issues. But, when it doesn't work, it's usually dysbiosis or poor environment like I had with mold.

The butyrate is also fantastic and quercetin as well. It's stimulating mucus for release and that mucus membrane, that mucus layer is if the gut lining is only one cell thick, the mucus lining can be up to 50 to 100 times thicker than that. It's not an actual cell but it's basically the moat for which the castle, stomach lining. So, building that moat with products like–I think another company have one called MegaMucosa and even the colostrum you take is really good at helping stimulate the mucus production. But, if you've got dysbiosis in your gut, then these gram-negative and these pathogenic bacteria actually eat away at the mucus and thin that out to the point where you don't really have much of a line of defense against other things that might be wanting to get into your circulation and invade and attack your own gut lining.

Ben:  Wow. Man, it's such a good formula. I know we're running tight on time because you've got skin peptides and some anti-aging skin care products, whole bunch of other stuff. Your site's going to be super fun for people to explore. And, I'll link to at BenGreenfieldLife.com/LVL.

But, one question I did want to ask you before I let you go, Kyal, is as far as the usage of this thing, if somebody orders it and comes and gets here from Australia, do you take this with the meal? Do you take it on an empty stomach? Do you take it multiple times per day? What's the best way to use it once you get a bottle?

Kyal:  I recommend people try first away from food. But, as we said with the zinc carnosine, it's at such a high dose. It might be unavoidable that you have nausea. So, taking it with fats or carbs is a really good way to prevent that nausea but just not a high amount of protein. The other formula that has BPC or the KPV, the standalones, they don't have that zinc in it, so most people aren't going to react to them. The only time someone might react negatively is if they have issues with fats because the other two have palmitoyl-ethanolamine PEA, which is a fatty acid. It's not in a huge amount, but I have heard maybe one out of a thousand people might react negatively to the PEA in anything. But yeah, taking it before meals is good too, especially if you know you're going to go out and be exposed to something that's going to trigger leaky gut. If you know you're going to go out for some crap food or have a pizza or a burger, having larazotide as that zonulin antagonist in circulation, it's going to prevent and reduce the damage that you would otherwise sustain from a cheat meal.

Ben:  Yeah. Maybe that's why I noticed the big effects when I'd use it when eating out. It's perfect for date night or going out to a restaurant or traveling in my opinion. That's where I really seem to notice the best effects on gut stability because I eat pretty clean at home. But, man, just to have this in your backpack, your first aid kit for travel is amazing.

For folks listening in, BenGreenfieldLife.com/LVL. I'll put more information about the supplement, the label, some of the details about it. And, I think we have a discount code somewhere. I'll hunt it down. I'll put it in there as well, so you can go check this out. I would also encourage you to surf around and look at some of Kyal's other products, particularly if you get the gut repair for me, if you get the TUDCA to go along with it if you want a little bit better bio flow, if you're in a high-fat diet for some of the other reasons that we mentioned.

I feel like we're going to have to do a round two, Kyal, because you go deep on this stuff and I would love to geek out with you again if you're game.

Kyal:  Yeah, it sounds good. We didn't even touch on skin peptides. I've got GAA, which is protein precursor coming out. [01:08:17] _____, which you've mentioned as well as an anti-hangover, anti-alcohol one. The backlog is pretty endless, as well as the skin peptides. So, your codes are BEN10, GREENFIELD, BDL, or GREENFIELD. You've got all of them. Anyone that you've used.

Ben:  They just all work, just type them all in.

Alright. Well, cool, man. I'm excited for people to get their hands on this stuff and give me feedback. And, if you guys have questions for me or Kyal, leave them in the shownotes. Go to BenGreenfieldLife.com/LVL. You can leave your questions, your comments, your feedback there. We'll be happy to hop in and help you out if you have any issues with ordering or anything like that. You can let us know too. And again, that's BenGreenfieldLife.com/LVL.

Kyal, I want to thank you so much for coming on the show and sharing all this stuff with us. Man, you're a wealth of knowledge.

Kyal:  It's an absolute honor. And, as I said during my cancer journey, Ben, your podcast gave me so much invaluable information into helping my mom's life way longer than she would have otherwise. So, a big thank you to you.

Ben:  Dude, that makes my day. Thank you so much, man.

Well, folks, I think that's a good note to end on. So, BenGreenfieldLife.com/LVL. And, until next time. I'm Ben Greenfield along with Kyal Van Der Leest signing out from Ben Greenfield Life. Have an amazing week.

I am coming to London June 16th through the 18th and I'm going to be a part of the Health Optimisation Summit over there. And, if you go to BenGreenfieldLife.com/Calendar, you can check out that event. Fantastic. Kind of like biohacking meets wellness meets massive health technology expo. But, while I'm there, I'm going to be in London with my whole family and we're actually going to head to Italy afterwards and cycle through Italy. But, I decided to put on a very special private, intimate VIP event with me while I am in London. It's at this crazy place called HUM2N, HUM2N, like human except of the 2.

So, HUM2N Labs, they are a creme de la creme biohacking facility. I mean, the best hyperbaric chambers, amazing selection of IVs, super nutrient cocktails, cryotherapy, red light therapy. We're basically going to party and biohack and do a Q&A with me and the fine proprietor of that facility, Dr. E, who's a wealth of knowledge in and of himself at that event. It's Monday, June 19th, so it's going to be private networking, live Q&A, great food, great cocktail/mocktails, experiential biohacks, a variety of healthy gourmet foods is just going to be really amazing. You're going to get a swag bag too. Your swag bag includes super nutrient IV, cryotherapy, red light therapy, and hyperbaric oxygen. That's worth 750 pounds alone. Then you got the H2MN supplements. They're going to give you their brain sharpener and their super blend protein. You get a travel voucher to take you to and from the event, meaning using a company called OUNO. They will bring you to and from the event if you have trouble finding it or don't want to drive.

So, there's a lot more that go into those swag bag too. But, right now, I have to tell you, this thing is going to fill up fast. It's in London, June 19th, and you get there by going to BenGreenfieldLife.com/HUM2NLondon. That's BenGreenfieldLife.com/HUM2NLondon. And, that will allow you to claim your spot at this fantastic event. So, BenGreenfieldLife.com/HUM2NLondon

More than ever these days, people like you and me need a fresh entertaining, well-informed, and often outside-the-box approach to discovering the health, and happiness, and hope that we all crave. So, I hope I've been able to do that for you on this episode today. And, if you liked it or if you love what I'm up to, then please leave me a review on your preferred podcast listening channel wherever that might be, and just find the Ben Greenfield Life episode. Say something nice. Thanks so much. It means a lot. 



A few months ago, I received a special package from Australia with some of the most unique and inventive supplement formulations I’ve seen in quite some time, particularly when it comes to healing the gut or fixing problematic digestive issues.

The guy who sent them to me, today’s podcast guest Kyal Van Der Leest, is the founder of LVLUP Health, a new-to-the-scene supplement company that has created a range of cutting-edge supplements using powerful ingredients that most people would not have heard of before. All the formulations were created in an attempt to reduce the multiple 6-12 products you might need to take for a health goal and simplify it down to an all-in-one product for every body system.

Kyal – a nutritionist, naturopath, and functional health coach turned formulator – founded LVLUP Health to create the products he wished he could have suggested when he worked in clinics and supplement stores and used during his own health journey. A fusion of different health modalities – using what works, no matter where it comes from – LVLUP's formulations target the root causes of health issues and work on a multitude of biochemical targets in the body, providing customers with products that actually work as promised.

Though he had numerous family members struggling with health issues, Kyal had a particularly desperate motivation to save his mother from stage 4 cancer, and although his mother Leanne has since passed, the products are a tribute to her. Without her, Kyal never would have learned about peptides, naturopathy, biohacking, and functional medicine, which form the foundation of LVLUP Health's approach to health and wellness. Today, LVLUP Health's products continue to provide customers with effective and accessible health solutions that honor Kyal's mother's legacy.

During our discussion, you'll discover:

-Ultimate Gut Repair formula and Kyle's morning routine…05:49

-How Kyal got into supplements, formulations, and biochemistry…11:54

  • Kyal’s mom was diagnosed with cancer 9 or 10 years ago
  • Researched mitochondrial health
  • Studied to be a nutritionist
  • Worked at a hyperbaric oxygen treatment facility
    • Was the most formative years
    • Patients were either elite performance athletes or very sick people with chronic disease
  • Was also a naturopath at a health foods store
  • Jobs at the health food store and the HBOT facility were really how he got into supplement formulations and natural health
  • In Australia, what you can and can't recommend is tightly regulated
    • Berberine can be used but dihydro berberine can't
  • ATP Science

-More about gut health…16:18

  • Leaky gut
  • Gut health is one of the core naturopathic tenets and principles
  • “All health begins in the gut” – Hippocrates
  • Had gut issues in the past from mold exposure
  • The GI Repair Formula was actually developed for a housemate who had Crohn's disease (friend never took it)
    • GI Repair Formula is just an IBD formulation (use any of the codes BEN, BEN10, BENGREENFIELD, BGL, and GREENFIELD, all for 10% off)
  • 70 to 80% of problems start with the gut (including the mouth-oral biome)
  • The Body Keeps The Score by Vessel van der Kolk
  • The Emotion Code by Dr. Bradley Nelson
  • A lot of it starts with the gut, but not all of it starts with the gut
  • If someone is going to be taking supplements, the gut is the place to start

-The implications of mold, biofilms, and parasites…21:34

  • Nasal chiropractic adjustment
  • Mold is damaging to the gut lining and is also disruptive to the hormones
  • Wounded healer approach to dealing with issues and presenting solutions you've discovered 
  • Kyal's upcoming proteolytic enzyme formulations:
    • Tyrosinase (breaks down mold and candida)
    • Nattokinase
    • Glucoamylase
    • Lumbrokinase 
  • Ben's advice for biofilm:
  • ParaX an all-in-one parasite and candida mold cleanse with grapefruit seed extract 
    • Ingredients of ParaX
      • Phytonoic
      • Andrographolide
      • Phytosure
      • Curcuminoids
      • Ellagic acid
      • Bisoline and Baicalin
      • Luteolin and Cafeic acid
      • Phenethyl ester
      • Monolaurin from coconut oil
      • Oregano

-What you need to know about leaky gut…34:05

  • The term “intestinal hyperpermeability” is more widely accepted
  • Zonulin is a big factor in leaky gut – is a marker of leaky gut
  • The more zonulin the more permeable the gut membrane
  • The gut membrane is like a mesh and zonulin increases the pore size of the mesh
  • Zonulin can be tested for in blood and fecal
  • A certain amount of zonulin to increase dietary absorption
  • Accumulation effect
  • Gut tests to check for leaky gut
  • Colostrum

-Gut Repair Formula ingredients…38:35

  • Gut Repair Formula is basically a combination of peptides and some naturopathic compounds (use any of the codes BEN, BEN10, BENGREENFIELD, BGL, and GREENFIELD, all for 10% off)
  • BPC 157 peptide
    • Can be oral, injectable or suppositories
    • Peptides go to areas of inflammation
    • Oral would be the best for gut issues
    • Suppositories for IBD, Crohn's or colitis
  • Ingredients:
    • Marshmallow roots
    • L-Glutamine
    • BPC 157 (arginate form protects it against acidity)
  • Fillers:
    • Palmitoylethanolamide (PEA)
    • Hyaluronic acid
  • Sodium Bicarbonate to buffer the pepsinogen to pepsin conversion
    • Alkaline water or something before you take even the acetate form and you'll get a better absorption orally,
    • tablespoon of bicarb soda with your peptides. You might get a bit of reflux or issues with the bicarb, but it'll protect the peptides from the proteolytic breakdown
  • KPV peptide
    • A fragment of melanocyte-stimulating hormone, α-MSH (3-amino acid fragment of MSH)
    • α-MSH is the parent peptide of many different peptide fragments like Melanotan
    • KPV effect
      • Good for people with Lyme disease, mold, or Chronic Fatigue, or who have chemical sensitivities
      • Mold is also a prerequisite for chronic conditions; exposure increases the chances of Alzheimer's
  • Zinc L-Carnosine
    • Has a strong healing effect on the gut lining
    • Some people may get nausea when taking Gut Repair Formula so halving the dose may help (use any of the codes BEN, BEN10, BENGREENFIELD, BGL and GREENFIELD, all for 10% off)
  • Larazotide Acetate (AT1001)
    • Antagonist to Zonulin
    • Binds to the receptors Zonulin would bind to
    • Being studied for celiac disease (it's called the anti-celiac peptide)
    • Zonulin also crosses the blood-brain barrier (brain fog could also be caused by leaky gut)
    • Larazotide is sealing the gut line
  • Tributyrin
    • A readily bioavailable form of butyrate 
    • A histone deacetylase inhibitor
    • BodyBio is another butyrate supplement
    • Butyrate can be used as an enema
  • Quercetin
    • 2 forms anhydrous and enzymatically modified isoquercitrin (EMIQ)
      • EMIQ is a 40 times more bioavailable form of quercetin
      • EMIQ is one of the best antihistamines
    • Is one of the best mast cell stabilizing ingredients
    • A local effect like preventing histamine in the lumen
      • Histamine opens the permeability of the gut lining causing diarrhea
      • Effects like itchy eyes and runny nose
  • The best way to use the product
    • Before meals
    • If sensitive to zinc, take with food that’s not high in protein
    • Ideal to use when eating in restaurants or traveling
    • You can also take alkaline water or something before you take it to get a better absorption
    • A tablespoon of bicarb soda will protect the peptides from the proteolytic breakdown
  • TUDCA (Tauro-Urso-Deoxy-Cholic Acid) can be stacked with Gut Repair Formula (use any of the codes BEN, BEN10, BENGREENFIELD, BGL, and GREENFIELD, all for 10% off) 
    • Promotes drainage and phase 3 detoxification
    • Beneficial for SIBO
    • A high enough dose is capable of wiping out gram-negative bacteria
    • Quickest-acting compound for lowering elevated liver enzymes (mold congests and clogs up the bile)
    • Antibacterial effect
    • Positively influents microbiome
    • Helpful with carnivore or keto diet
    • Fat absorption
    • Helpful for liver, thyroid, mitochondrial production
  • Podcast with Dane Johnson:

-And much more…

Click here for the full written transcript of this podcast episode.

Upcoming Events:

  • Health Optimisation Summit: June 17th – 18th, 2023

Join me at The Health Optimisation Summit in London! This is your chance to be part of a community of 2,500 like-minded people and learn from world-leading health speakers. You'll be able to fast-track your health journey, discover cutting-edge secrets and hacks, explore the latest tech and gadgets, and find the cleanest and healthiest supplements and nutrient-dense foods. Don't miss out on this incredible experience! Learn more here.

  • Hum2n Event: June 19th, 2023

Don’t miss this incredible opportunity to learn from the best in the field and take your biohacking journey to the next level. You’ll get the chance to be involved with a private network of biohackers, a live discussion with myself and Dr. E, a live Q&A, an experiential biohacking experience, tasty food, and a chance to win some mind-blowing prizes! Learn more here.

Resources mentioned in this episode:

Kyal Van Der Leest

– Podcasts:

– Books:

– Other Resources:

Episode sponsors:

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Do you have questions, thoughts or feedback for Kyal Van Der Leest or me? Leave your comments below and one of us will reply!

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